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normal Lull Mattrress

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10 Feb 2016 08:39 #1 by PapaMike

I received a marketing text from Lull Mattress. Seems to be a new start up company.

I asked for specifics on configuration, components, etc.

Reply: Our materials are proprietary and confidential. No mattress company shares what you're asking for.

I guess they didn't study the industry before they launched.

Beware.

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10 Feb 2016 11:14 #2 by Phoenix

Hi PapaMike,

I guess they didn't study the industry before they launched.


I guess not :)

They were launched in October of last year by Steven Klein at Scalable Commerce which is basically a marketing and brand building company and they are included in the "avoid until complete specs are known" section of the simplified choice list here .

Phoenix


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08 Mar 2016 08:14 #3 by LullSleepExpert

Hi PapaMike,

We sincerely apologize if you feel we did not adequately answer your question regarding our mattress. In addition, with all due respect, we did not communicate to you in the way that you posted here. In response to your question about foam densities one of our sleep experts replied, "That's a great question, the density of the foam is proprietary information & is not released." Your reply to that was, "fail". Our sleep expert responded, "Industry-wide, foam density information is not publicly released. What we can speak to is the quality of our mattress as we use Certi-PUR US certified foams." In no way were we attempting to disrespect you or be vague with our responses, our sleep expert was simply following protocol.

As you can see on our website, lull.com/mattress , our mattress is composed of three layers of CertiPUR-US certified foam. This includes a Gel-infused memory foam, a proprietary blend of conventional foam and a polyurethane foam. As a company policy we do not publish foam densities or ILDs for our mattress which allows us to maintain ownership of the proprietary mattress formula that we have developed. However, we have no problem disclosing the materials of our mattress for those interested. . In addition, we have found that prospective customers care more about overall comfort, cost savings, convenience & experience than they do about the technical specs (densities, ILDs) of our mattress.

Again, we apologize for any misunderstanding here and our sleep experts are standing by to discuss any questions Mon - Fri from 6am to 6pm PST and Sat/Sun from 6am to 4pm PST at 1-800-301-5845.

Thanks guys.

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08 Mar 2016 09:30 #4 by Phoenix

Hi LullSleepExpert,

Thanks for registering and adding your comments ... although I would strongly disagree with your comments about so called "proprietary" materials.

What we can speak to is the quality of our mattress as we use Certi-PUR US certified foams." In no way were we attempting to disrespect you or be vague with our responses, our sleep expert was simply following protocol.


CertiPUR is a "safety" certification that tests to make sure that any harmful substances and VOCs are within the limits of their testing protocols. While a CertiPUR certification for polyfoam or memory foam would confirm that a material would be "safe enough" for most people ... it doesn't say anything meaningful about the relative quality or durability of the materials.

As a company policy we do not publish foam densities or ILDs for our mattress which allows us to maintain ownership of the proprietary mattress formula that we have developed. However, we have no problem disclosing the materials of our mattress for those interested. .


While some information can legitimately be considered to be proprietary to a manufacturer ... there are many manufacturers that claim that the information you would need to make an informed choice is also somehow "proprietary" but I certainly wouldn't agree. You can read a little more about "so called" proprietary materials and using this as a justification for not disclosing what I would consider to be essential information here and here and here .

In addition, we have found that prospective customers care more about overall comfort, cost savings, convenience & experience than they do about the technical specs (densities, ILDs) of our mattress.


While I agree that information that has to do with "comfort" or "performance" specs (such as ILD) have little value to a customer because the only way to know whether a mattress is a suitable choice in terms of "comfort", firmness, and PPP is with careful testing or their own personal experience ... information that is directly connected to the quality and durability of a mattress (such as foam type and density) and allows a customer to make meaningful comparisons with other mattresses (see this article ) is one of the most important parts of making an informed choice.

Buying a mattress without knowing the type and quality of the materials inside it would be like buying a computer without knowing the capacity of a hard drive, the amount of memory, or the speed of the CPU and would make it impossible to make meaningful comparisons. Unlike most consumers that have no idea about the materials inside a mattress ... the members of this site would know that no matter how comfortable a mattress may when it's new ... the quality and durability of a mattress is a key factor in the "value" of a mattress purchase. There would be little value in buying a mattress that didn't maintain it's comfort and support for a reasonable period of time and mattress warranties only cover materials defects and not the loss of comfort and support that can happen more rapidly with lower quality and less durable materials.

Our sleep expert responded, "Industry-wide, foam density information is not publicly released.


While much of the mainstream industry and the major brands don't disclose foam density information ... many smaller independent manufacturers do and most of your online competitors in what I call the "simplified choice" category (see post #2 here ) are also happy to disclose this information as well so you are one of the exceptions and certainly not the "norm".

I would consider information that directly relates to the quality and durability of the materials in a mattress to be an essential part of the "value" of a mattress purchase and I would encourage any consumer and the members of this site to avoid any mattress where the manufacturer or retailer either isn't able or willing to disclose the information that they need to make an informed choice and make meaningful quality/value comparisons with other mattresses. Disclosing foam density certainly isn't enough information for anyone to be able to "duplicate" your mattress and there is no legitimate reason for it to be proprietary.

Phoenix


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