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Cirrus Luxe-ES 13....is it a poor man's Tempur Cloud Luxe?

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06 Jul 2012 12:07 #1 by BigManLittleLady
Hi Phoenix,

So I had written awhile ago about trying to find the right bed for my girlfriend and I. We are complete opposites in size, hence my screen name. My girlfriend is simply in love with the Tempurpedic Cloud Luxe. I have laid on it several times in many positions and I admit I can't find a ton of fault in the bed (other than your previous critiques of the bed and of course the price). Most of the other forums in which you've spoke about the Cloud you haven't necessarily said the material that make up the mattresses is altogether poor quality, its just for what you are getting the price is inflated. So I have a few questions....

First, as a larger guy (although I'm slowing becoming a more normal sized guy and if I stay on my current path I'll be closer to 200lbs then the 265lb I am now) will a memory foam mattress like the Cloud or Cirrus give me any problems down the line? Note that I don't currently have any pain from sleeping.

Second, I know in one of your other forums you recommended to someone who was looking into memory foam to check our Memoryfoam.com. The Cirrus Luxe-ES 13 is their equivalent to the Cloude Luxe from Tempurpedic. The difference in the layering based on their websites are as follows:

Cirrus Luxe:
Comfort Layer: 2.5” 4lb SELECT-ES™ Foam
Mattress Core: 2” 8lb SELECT-HD™ Support Layer
Cooling Chamber: Channeled COOLTECH™ Layer
Base: Polyurethane base, made extra-thick to provide a lifetime of support

Tempurpedic Cloud Luxe:
Comfort Layer 2.75" of extra-soft TEMPUR-ES™ material
Support Layer 2" of highly-conforming TEMPUR-HD® material
Base Layer 8.25" Dual AirFlow System

So as far as quality and durability how does the Cirrus Luxe stand up against the Tempurpedic Cloud Luxe? And are there other memory foam companies that I could look at as well to increase my choices?

Essentially, I am going to end up with a Tempurpedic Cloud Luxe if I can't find a suitable replacement as my girlfriend is dead set on getting one.

Thanks for all your help Phoenix!

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06 Jul 2012 15:51 - 10 Dec 2015 20:30 #2 by Phoenix
Hi BigManLittleLady,

Most of the other forums in which you've spoke about the Cloud you haven't necessarily said the material that make up the mattresses is altogether poor quality, its just for what you are getting the price is inflated. So I have a few questions....


Yes ... the quality of the Tempurpedic has never been at issue (at least until the introduction of their new Simplicity line which uses much lower quality 2.5 lb memory foam which is among the lowest memory foam density available). The real issue with them has always been price and value and with so many good memory foam options availabe that also use high quaity memory foam ... there is just no reason to go with Tempurpedic IMO unless there is some specific reason that someone would be willing to pay these prices for similar density and quality foam that they could purchase elsewhere.

So except for the new Simplicity line ... Tempurpedic is high quality but poor value. The simplicity is lower quality and poor value.

First, as a larger guy (although I'm slowing becoming a more normal sized guy and if I stay on my current path I'll be closer to 200lbs then the 265lb I am now) will a memory foam mattress like the Cloud or Cirrus give me any problems down the line? Note that I don't currently have any pain from sleeping.


For higher weights like yours it's usually a good idea to go with higher density or quality foams. While there are some good quality 4 lb foams available (such as the top layers in the cloud series and manyothers) ... none of them will have the same durability as 5 lb foam. If the feel of 4 lb memory foam is the most important thing ... then at least the consumer would know ahead of time that the mattress will be less durable than if they had used a higher density foam but this would be part of their "value equation". Some of the factors involved in the durability of a mattress are discussed in post #2 here . The only other issue is that because memory foam layers will soften, the softening can have more of an effect on the mattress if the memofy foam layers are too thick for the person and this could lead to some degree of loss of support that keeps you in alignment. This too will depend on many factors and depends on where you were in the "range" of your support needs when you first purchased a particular mattress and how much softening it would take to put you on the wrong side of the line.

So as far as quality and durability how does the Cirrus Luxe stand up against the Tempurpedic Cloud Luxe? And are there other memory foam companies that I could look at as well to increase my choices?


Memoryfoam.com and Selectfoam.com are the same company and they and others (including one of our members of the site) are listed among a few of the better memory foam options in post #12 here .

In terms of quality and durability they use similar density foams in a similar thickness and layering so they would be very similar yes.

NOTE ADDED: Select Foam was a member of this site but because of ongoing customer service issues and delays their membership was terminated and I would read the warning here before considering them.

Of course this doesn't say anything about the "feel" of a mattress because there are many versions of memory foam ... each with it's own properties and responses. Some of the differences between memory foams are listed in post #9 here . It seems though that their mattresses are designed to have a similar feel to many of the tempurpedic models so they wold likely be fairly similar ... although anything to do with "feel" is also very subjective. I would certainly talk with them to see if they can add any more details about the similarities and differences between them based on their customer's feedback and their own personal knowledge.

Phoenix

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Last edit: 10 Dec 2015 20:30 by Phoenix.

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06 Jul 2012 17:23 - 06 Jul 2012 19:04 #3 by BigManLittleLady
Hi Phoenix,

Thank you for the reply. I know that Sears carries the Select Foam Cirrus Luxe-ES 13 so hopefully I can find one near me that has one in their store. As you mentioned feel is very subjective especially when you are dealing with somone (my gf) who already has their mind made up like I am :ohmy: . If the feel of the Cirrus Luxe-ES 13 is close to the Cloud Luxe then I feel based on the similar qualities of memory foam present that it would be a suitable alternative. Not to mention $2400 for the Cirrus versus $4800 for the Cloud is an easy decision in my book.

My biggest concern before purchasing a "non major brand name mattress" is that i'm not sacrificing quality. I won't pretend to have the knowledge that you do on the mattress industry so when you say I won't be sacrificing quality with the Cirrus I feel confident :). I guess I'm easily convinced, its my gf that will take some convincing. To her going from a tempurpedic to a company called SelectFoam is like going from Prada Shoes to a pair sold at Kohls (that's not a dig at kohls as I'm wearing a pair right now).

To your knowledge, are there any major complaints or issues with the SelectFoam brand? Are they a member of this site or is foamorder the member? Essentially what I'm getting at is there any reason why I would want to search elsewhere for what I'm looking for which is a similar bed to the Cloud Luxe at a more reasonable price.

EDIT: I just read a bunch of awful reviews/complaints on the selectfoam via the BBB. Should I be concerned??

Thanks,
Adam

P.S. I appreciate you answering all of our questions as I know you probably report yourself then kindergarden teacher.

P.P.S. Anyone who is reading this forum and owns a Cirrus Luxe-ES 13 please give me your thoughts as well.
Last edit: 06 Jul 2012 19:04 by BigManLittleLady.

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06 Jul 2012 22:29 - 10 Dec 2015 20:28 #4 by Phoenix
Hi BigManLittleLady,

Sears online is like Amazon or Overstock lists lots of products on their site that are sold by the outlets that they don't carry. If you look at the listing it says "sold and shipped by Select Foam Inc" which means that they don't carry it in their stores.

Not to mention $2400 for the Cirrus versus $4800 for the Cloud is an easy decision in my book.


It would be an easy decision between the two in my book as well!

You may want to show your girlfriend this article (and there's lots more you can find with a google search) about the recent share price crash of Tempurpedic because so many people are recognizing that their mattresses don't have the value that they advertise and are buying alternatives. It was long overdue but it seemed to happen very quickly once Tempurpedic acknowledged that they were being out-competed in the memory foam niche which they have "owned" for way too long.

My biggest concern before purchasing a "non major brand name mattress" is that i'm not sacrificing quality. I won't pretend to have the knowledge that you do on the mattress industry so when you say I won't be sacrificing quality with the Cirrus I feel confident . I guess I'm easily convinced, its my gf that will take some convincing. To her going from a tempurpedic to a company called SelectFoam is like going from Prada Shoes to a pair sold at Kohls (that's not a dig at kohls as I'm wearing a pair right now).


If a brand name makes a model that uses quality materials with good value ... then that model has value. But you don't sleep on the brand label ... you sleep on the materials in a mattress. Of course to some a name seems to be important for other reasons but the label on a mattress has nothing to do with quality. It's always the materials and construction that counts. The new Tempurpedic Simplicity line for example uses 2.5 lb memory foam which is the absolute lowest densty/quality you can find anywhere. They introduced it as a "cheaper" version of their higher quality lines with the idea that people who believed that the name was worth buying would spend $1199 for a queen which is over twice the price of similar mattresses that use the same or usually better quality materials. It's basically a "cheap" mattress disguised with a label as a much more expensive one and just waiting for people who buy by brand to spend the money so that their share prices can go back up again.

To your knowledge, are there any major complaints or issues with the SelectFoam brand? Are they a member of this site or is foamorder the member? Essentially what I'm getting at is there any reason why I would want to search elsewhere for what I'm looking for which is a similar bed to the Cloud Luxe at a more reasonable price.

EDIT: I just read a bunch of awful reviews/complaints on the selectfoam via the BBB. Should I be concerned??


I see the same reports as anyone else with google searches and each person needs to decide how much weight they put on each one. The BBB can be a bad joke joke sometimes and if you look at the report you will see one unresolved complaint. You will also see that one of the factors that raised their rating was their response to the complaints which to me says more than the complaints themselves for a high volume business. The BBB rates businesses very differently depending on whether a business decides to become a member or not (they're just a private company like any other that tries to get people to pay them money to become a member) and I know of a high quality business for example that had a single unresolved complaint that was on their BBB report that they didn't even know about and for years the BBB listed them with an F. They finally decided to "cave in" and become a member and within a few days their rating was changed to an A and it has remained there for over a year. There is a very revealing video and article here done by ABC News about the BBB.

While the BBB can have some value in some cases ... they are also not so "neutral" towards non members. The more business a company does ... the more complaints they will have as a percentage of their business. While I don't personally know the owners, I have talked with them and they and their staff have always provided good service to me when I called them for information.

I also take many bad online reviews and complaints with a big grain of salt because many of them are from consumers that are complaining about a poor choice they made and are trying to make a business responsible for a choice they made that has nothing to do with the quality of a product they bought. I see many complaints about a mattress being "too firm" or "too soft" or similar from consumers that didn't take the time to do their homework before they made a purchase and then complained about a policy they should have already known or asked about or imply that the suitability of a mattress is the same as it's quality. Of course there are many legitimate complaints as well and these can be valuable to know if they become a pattern and its important to be able to tell the difference.

I am a big advocate in other words of both consumer education and responsibility and a business' responsibility to provide good and honest service to their customers. While I see many legitimate issues that are invaluable to know about and the internet has been a huge help in the transparency and flow of information ... I also see a lot of accusations that are sometimes unjustified (in both directions) and unfortunately these can haunt a good business and/or good people that aren't able to erase the record of an unjustified complaint or bad review that was more about passing blame or shifting responsibility than it was about reporting a legitimate issue.

I guess there's "good and bad" in everything and part of the challenge is to discern the difference :)

NOTE ADDED: Select Foam was a member of this site but because of ongoing customer service issues and delays their membership was terminated and I would read the warning here before considering them.

Phoenix

Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
For any mattress questions Ask An Expert on our forum
Last edit: 10 Dec 2015 20:28 by Phoenix.

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