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What do you know about the Kluft Raphael

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09 Jun 2014 03:26 #1 by Mom of 2
Hi Phoenix,

I wrote a while back about the Bliss Pristine latex mattress, which we were prepared to purchase. When we went to purchase it, it was out of stock. Because we were returning a tempurpedic (Cloud Luxe Breeze) and needed a mattress right away, we decided to try another Tempurpedic (Cloud Luxe) in the meantime, as that is really what my husband wanted to do. Well we both hate it. For me it was too warm (I suspected it would be) and my husband is developing some lower back pain. We have been sleeping in it for just over two weeks now. Now we are ready to exchange it for the Pristine.

But before we do I wanted to ask you about another mattress we tried called the Kluft Raphael in Bloomingdales. I read your post about this manufacturer, which I realize is not very forthcoming with information on the materials used, but we both liked the feel of the mattress which I believe is 85% Talalay latex. Not sure what the other materials are and I don't feel they provide enough information on that (at least on the website). The one thing that I do not like about it is that the salesperson said you cannot use it on an adjustable base. Something about the rigid frame around the edges of the mattress. She said you could only bend it slightly. Do you know if this is true? Because if it is, that is a deal breaker for us. We have an adjustable base and want to use it! Then while speaking to another sales person (in another store) who used to sell that bed, he said you could use an adjustable base. Not sure who to believe!

I really like the Pristine, but my husband is worried if we don't like it, we will not be able to exchange a second time. Bloomingdales has a very generous exchange policy and that is what is appealing to us right now. But I can't seem to get any consistent information on the Raphael. Can you help?

Thanks so much.

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09 Jun 2014 07:19 #2 by Phoenix
Hi Mom of 2,

But before we do I wanted to ask you about another mattress we tried called the Kluft Raphael in Bloomingdales. I read your post about this manufacturer, which I realize is not very forthcoming with information on the materials used, but we both liked the feel of the mattress which I believe is 85% Talalay latex. Not sure what the other materials are and I don't feel they provide enough information on that (at least on the website).


You could check the percentage of latex by weight on the law tag (although this won't tell you the percentage by thickness). The description says that there is 8" of latex in the mattress and the mattress is 13.5" high so 5.5" in the mattress (by thickness) are missing from the description and I would certainly want to know what they were before even remotely considering this mattress because they could certainly be a weak link in the mattress.

The one thing that I do not like about it is that the salesperson said you cannot use it on an adjustable base. Something about the rigid frame around the edges of the mattress. She said you could only bend it slightly. Do you know if this is true?


They are referring to a polyfoam "racetrack" perimeter around some of the foam layers (you can see the description here ) which are used to provide edge support (see post #3 here for more about polyfoam edge support with latex). It's possible that the edge support could delaminate with constant bending but if you call Kluft they should be able to tell you more "authoritatively".

Phoenix

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04 Aug 2014 20:42 #3 by TwoCrows
We have a Kluft Raphael. The description on the Bloomingdale's site is not correct -- the mattress is about 12" thick. Underneath the fabric top and fire-retarding layers is 1.5" of quilting foam, with non-latex foam under the latex support layers. There are three layers of latex -- a 2" Celsion layer, 3" talalay, and 3" dunlop, so by thickness about 2/3 of the mattress is latex (although by weight it may be more).

We loved it at the store and it was on sale for about 1/2 price but still a budget buster. Never-the-less, we bought it, and three years later my wife (about 120 lbs) and I (about 200 lbs) both consider it too soft -- although it was the initial softness that appealed to us.

If we were to buy a bed again I would seriously consider the Flobed or similar Savvy Rest as a much cheaper alternative, in large part because I like the ability to customize them.

I hope this is useful and not too late.

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04 Aug 2014 22:04 - 04 Aug 2014 22:06 #4 by Phoenix
Hi TwoCrows,

Thanks for the feedback about your Kluft Rafael ... and hopefully it can help others to avoid the same mistake. While there would be an argument that it would be "worth it" if you were still sleeping well on it, even if the mattress was still in good condition and you were sleeping well on it there are many other latex mattresses available that use similar amounts of latex (8" of a mixture of blended Talalay and Dunlop) for about 25% of their "list prices" (which of course are fake but they would still be about half the price or less of a "half price" sale).

We loved it at the store and it was on sale for about 1/2 price but still a budget buster. Never-the-less, we bought it, and three years later my wife (about 120 lbs) and I (about 200 lbs) both consider it too soft -- although it was the initial softness that appealed to us.


It would be unfortunate to have to dispose of a mattress that still has 8" of latex inside it that is likely to still be in good condition after only 3 years and there are some suggestions in post #4 here that may help you extend the life of the mattress (including "mattress surgery" if you are up for a challenge).

Thanks again for taking the time to share your feedback.

Phoenix

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Last edit: 04 Aug 2014 22:06 by Phoenix.

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27 Sep 2019 15:11 #5 by TwoCrows
I'd like to add to my reply from 5 years ago. The real problem was that the mattress had developed what felt like deep body impressions and had bottomed out on the Talalay layers underneath, which are 44 ILD.
Now for the good news. I called Bloomingdale's to find out when we had bought the mattress and in the course of talking to customer service they volunteered to send someone out to see if it was covered under warranty. To my intense surprise, they said the impression is deep enough to be covered by the warranty. After all the horror stories I've read about warranty, this was welcome news that the full price of the mattress we bought eight years ago would be credited to a new mattress at Bloomingdale's.

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29 Sep 2019 18:22 #6 by Phoenix
Hi TwoCrows,

Welcome back to our Mattress Forum :)!

Thank you for sharing a great experience about your mattress issues and “warranty” claim outcome …. all these years. TMU has plenty of posts about warranty scams and games the some of the mattress industry players engage into. It’s very refreshing to hear about Bloomingdales working with a fair warranty claim process and giving the credit for the new mattress. Kudos to Bloomingdale’s, with almost old-style department store service.

Once again, thanks for remembering and taking the time to update us after a long time (5 years later!!!)

Phoenix

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