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Hi All,
Wow, my eyes have been opened from this site. Thank goodness, I think you saved me from buying another piece of crap. Some information on me: I have never found a bed in a US hotel that I liked. However, I have found some beds abroad - in Greece, a bed in Vietnam, even in Hungary that fit the bill. I have also found some horrible beds while traveling - Paris. Sometimes I was paying the bill, sometimes the company was. But I generally like a bed that is quite firm, and my worst nightmare is sagging, of any kind. I am having trouble believing that latex could be better than innerspring, but as you all say, that will be something I will have to test for myself. Anyway, just wondering - what did beds used to be made out of? Are there any differences between european or asian materials and US ones due to regulations, inflammability, chemical treatments, that sort of thing? Can anyone speak knowledgeably about cultural differences in bed preferences, construction, materials, etc? Thanks for all the help here. |
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Hi mitop,
Latex is among the most durable materials in the industry but durability also depends on whether you are comparing comfort layers or support layers because the comfort layers of a mattress are usually the weakest link in a mattress not the support layers. Innersprings will also have some type of other materials and comfort layers on top of them (such as polyfoam, memory foam, latex foam, or natural or synthetic fibers) because you can't sleep directly on the springs and which materials you choose will have a significant effect on the feel, performance, and durability of the mattress. Latex is also a much more popular choice in Europe and in some parts of Asia than it is in North America. The "bottom line" though is that all materials come in a wide range of firmness choices and in a wide range of quality/durability choices as well so a mattress that is the best match for any particular person can vary widely.
This depends on which area of the world you are talking about and how far back you are looking but memory foam is the newest of the major materials that are currently used in mattresses and before that there was polyfoam and before that was latex and before that was innersprings and before that there were various natural fibers (such as cotton or wool or even rags that were used as stuffing) and even before that there was almost anything that was available that could be used to make a mattress that provided reasonable levels of comfort and support. You can see an article here about the oldest mattress ever discovered (over 50,000 years old) and it had a design concept that is similar to today's mattresses with firmer support layers, softer comfort layers, and materials that could repel bugs in the top layers. It's also true that different cultures can have different physiologies, different body types, and different materials that were available to use in a mattress so the mattresses that are more popular in different areas of the world can be very different. People from an Asian culture for example have a much higher percentage of people that sleep in a supine position than any other culture (such as Caucasian, African, or Indian who tend to have a higher percentage that sleep in a lateral position) and do much better with and strongly prefer much firmer mattresses than most people in western cultures would do best with or would prefer to sleep on. Some brief quotes from this book (there would be too much to type anything but brief excerpts) which is one of the best books on sleeping surfaces and designs that I have read ...
The quote goes on to describe more research and studies in some extensive detail about physiological differences in Asians that can have a significant effect on the type of sleeping surface that would generally be suitable (in cultural terms because none of this can apply to individuals who may not fit the "averages" of their culture). Some brief quotes about local sleeping habits: Asia:
China:
Japan:
Korea:
Southeast Asia: (Laos, Viet Nam, Cambodia, Thailand, Indonesia)
India:
New Guniea:
Africa:
Latin America:
North America:
Europe:
Arab World:
There is much more to the history of sleeping surfaces and materials and cultural differences in different areas of the world than just this of course but it would be outside of the scope of this forum (and my fingers' ability to transcribe ![]() Phoenix Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read
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Last edit: by phoenix.
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what a wonderful answer Phoenix! Sorry I didn't respond before, but I do appreciate all the effort that you put into the response and directing me towards the book. It makes sense, my husband is from a European area with a very hearty cuisine and very muscular and wide, while I am a mix of many different cultures (welsh, polish, Asian). Our body types are very different, so it will be interesting to see how this turns out.
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Hi mitop,
I appreciated the question because it gave me a chance to add some information to the forum that others may find interesting as well.
The first part of post #2 here has some information about several options that can be helpful for couples with different needs and preferences because of different body types or sleeping styles. I'm also looking forward to finding out what you end up deciding ... and of course any comments or questions you may have along the way ![]() Phoenix Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read
The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
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Hi Phoenix,
Just thought I would chime in here. Just got back from Original Mattress Factory and Restwell. Was not as impressed with Original Mattress Factory nor their selection, but did rather like Restwell mattresses, which seemed to be higher quality and better selection. They are having a good sale on a mattress I liked, that is $650 for a mattress with box spring (and to be honest, $650 is about what my husband and I can afford for a mattress right now), but I am rather concerned about the quality that I am getting. One of my big issues is when I ask for densities, both OMF and Restwell told me me 1.8 lbs. I trained as an engineer, so I pressed the salesperson is that lbs per cubic foot or lbs per cubic inch? "It's pounds per square inch," he assured me, but when I performed the calculation, 1.2 lbs per square inch that he related would be ~144 lbs per square foot...and that is also not a density, it's a unit of pressure! (Force per unit area) Sorry that I am confused about what are the "default" units for mattress measurement. If you could clarify this for me, that would help. I think I like innerspring from restwell better than memory foam I have tried anywhere else (also did not really the OMF latex) but I am confirming the specifications of the mattress my husband and I liked and am trying to keep quality in mind. We really don't want to spend another $650-$700 two years down the line. So far, in the mattress that we liked, I think that the polyfoam is 1.8 lb per (pending reply, square foot) on the top and bottom (again - have to confirm that this is a two-sided mattress, but I tried to make sure most of the ones I liked met this criteria) but there is a support polyfoam of 1.2 lbs per square (foot - again, pending reply) I think. I found this that you wrote, "Regular conventional polyfoam: This is the lowest grade of polyfoam and weighs less than 1.5 lbs per cubic foot. It is the least expensive and is not really suitable for use in a mattress at all ... either as a soft comfort layer (unless it is in the range of around an inch or so or less in a quilting layer) or as a support material ... unless the mattress is for occasional use or is meant to last a very short time. Mattresses with regular polyfoam in a support layer should be completely avoided for regular use as they will break down quickly and do not have the desireable qualities that are needed in a support layer." from here: www.themattressunderground.com/mattresses/comfort-layers/polyurethane-foam.html so I'm thinking that if the mattress price seemed to good to be true, it probably is. I am confirming the heights of each layer, to make sure that everything adds up to the stated mattress height. Anyway, I also found this other article that you wrote: www.themattressunderground.com/mattress-forum/general-mattresses/995-enso-mattress-opinion.html It's an article from about 3 years ago with a gentleman who has a similar budget to me, and you told him that his options for a good mattress in his price range, are sadly, not very good. You steered him towards some mattresses from walmart, and I'm wondering if I should direct my search there? I quite liked the Restwell mattresses, but until I can be sure the quality will hold up, I'm scared to commit. Thanks for any input, Phoenix! (PS This is also my mom's name in her native language, but when she came to the US her paperwork got messed up and now her name means Orchid. I wonder if you have a similar story for choosing your name?) Sincerely, mitop |
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Hi mitop,
That's unfortunate because they certainly do have some good quality/value mattresses available.
I would be cautious here and make sure you find out the foam densities in their mattresses because some of them use lower quality foams than I would suggest considering (see the guidelines here ).
While foam density could be expressed as any unit weight per unit volume measurement ... in North America the standard is lbs / ft3 (the weight of a cubic foot of material). ILD (indentation load compression used most commonly with latex) or IFD (indentation force compression used most commonly with polyfoam or memory foam) are measures of firmness which are measured by the force or weight it takes for a 50 sq in round compressor head to compress a layer of material (generally a 15" x 15" or 20" x 20" four inch thick piece of polyfoam or memory foam or a 6" thick latex core) by 25% of its original thickness (although in some cases the measurement is for different percentages such as 40%).
I would make sure you find out all the information in this article and I think you may discover that the comfort layers are 1.2 lb density (which is lower quality than I would consider if it is more than "about an inch or so").
I would confirm the height and the density of each layer. While it's not always true that "you get what you pay for" because there are some particularly good value mattresses and some that are not good value at all ... I would always make sure that you know the type and quality of every layer in any mattress you are considering.
I looked through the topic you linked and couldn't see any mention of his budget or any comments about Walmart or about the options he had available. Did you link the correct thread? There is more about buying from Walmart or other similar stores like Costco in post #4 here . Post #3 and #4 here also includes some of the better online options I'm aware of for lower budget latex and latex hybrid mattresses and post #4 here includes some of the better online options I'm aware of for other types of mattresses in lower budget ranges.
I have used "Phoenix" as my online username in many places since I was first online (back to the days of bulletin boards and phone modem access) and for me it represents the mythological bird that "rises up out of the ashes" ![]() Phoenix Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read
The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
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Last edit: by phoenix.
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Thank you Phoenix!
You're right, the Restwell mattress that I liked in the store used more than 3 3/4" of 1.2 lb per cubic foot polyfoam. Too much of a low density polyfoam, as you noted, will cause the mattress to lose the feeling it had in the store. I will go back and perhaps give another try with the Original Mattress Factory mattresses. The mattresses were fine, but unfortunately, with time, I did not feel as if I had the correct PPP - pressure and posture relief (to my personal preference) for side sleeping. Perhaps my husband and I should have tried mattresses that were less firm. Thank you for your input. Back to the drawing board. |
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Hi mitop,
I know you are probably aware of this but there are also some additional options in the Minneapolis area in post #2 here that may be worth including in your research as well. Phoenix Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read
The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members. For any mattress questions Ask An Expert on our forum |
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