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desperately need help with a hand -made talalay latex bed,please 25 Dec 2014 07:02 #1

hi everyone ,I could sure use some advice on a new bed.

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Last edit: by kayla.

desperately need help with a hand -made talalay latex bed,please 25 Dec 2014 11:16 #2

Hi kayla,

While nobody can provide specific advice because there are too many unknowns and variables involved and only you can feel what you feel on a mattress ... I can certainly provide some more generic information that can help you decide which of the options or changes that are available to you may have the best chance of success.

Post #2 here has more about the most common symptoms that people generally experience on a mattress and some of the reasons that can cause them.

There is more about primary or deep support and secondary or surface support and their relationship to pressure relief and firmness in post #2 here and in post #4 here that may help you visualize and understand what good support/alignment and pressure relief "looks like".

Then I had local bedmakers make me an 11 inch talaly latex mattess.IT was over 4000.00 to buy and NO RETURNS but they do exchange layers for a month..this bed graduates in layers ,form harder to very soft on top.

At first my neck was killing me but I think that was from sleeping in zero gravity position on adjustable.


Neck issues are most commonly connected to a pillow that doesn't keep your head and neck in good alignment in all your sleeping positions.

It's unfortunate that you only have a month to try different configurations because this doesn't give you much time to sleep on your initial combination for very long or to try different combinations for more than a few days which may not be enough to be able to decide whether they are a good match for you because there will generally be an adjustment period when you sleep on a sleeping surface that is very different from what you are used to sleeping on (see post #3 here and post #2 here ). I would normally try an initial combination for a couple of weeks at a minimum whenever possible so that you have time to get used to it and after that I would try each different combination for at least a few days so that you can confirm that how you sleep or any "symptoms" you experience on each new combination are more of a pattern that "points to" your longer term experience rather than just an anomaly that you only experience for a day or two.

I asked for a switch to medium on top.Well then my neck ache went away but boy am I getting some stiff muscles form the support.should mention I have a wool topper 2 inches to soften the feel.
the soft layer on top made this mattress ultra plush.
but 3 days on this medium is killing me ...my lower back is a bit sore and I feel I get less sleep.


Your wool topper may be interfering with the ability of the latex to contour to the shape of your body and could be making your mattress feel firmer rather than softer (see post #8 here and the posts it links to about wool toppers). It may be worth trying your mattress without the wool topper to see if it makes any difference.

i dont know if i should keep trying with this mattress as it is quite nice.


This is something that only you can decide based on your personal experience but you mentioned that there isn't a return policy so it seems to me that you would have little to lose by trying different combinations over the course of your trial period or even some of the other options that you would have available after your trial period is over (such as rearranging layers or adding a topper if you need some extra softness) before you decide to give up on the mattress completely.

but its hurting to switch form tempur to the latex.I mean really.Im not looking for support,Im looking for comfort.
I want to keep trying I only had 2 days of the soft top layer and really want o go back to it.but the medium seems more supportive.

I have even thought abt dumping the 4 grand bed and going back to tempur.at 290 lbs not sure i should be in tempur?it has 5 in of temper material 13 inches thick


As you can see from the previous links I posted ... firmer doesn't necessarily mean better support and pressure relief is also an important part of a sleeping system. If you slept well on the softer top layer and the only issue was your neck pain (which is most commonly a pillow issue) then it may be well worth trying your initial combination once again.

The choice of materials is always a personal preference rather than a "better/worse" choice. There are a wide range of firmness levels and designs with every type of mattress and material and regardless of which type of mattress or materials you prefer ... some mattresses may work well for you and others of the same general type that uses the same materials may be completely unsuitable for you to sleep on. This would depend more on the design of the particular mattress and how well it matches your specific needs and preferences in terms of PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) than it does on the type of materials that it uses. There is more about some of the differences between latex and memory foam in post #2 here but your own personal experience will be the best way to decide which type of materials you tend to prefer.

Again ... I would keep in mind that when you are first sleeping on a mattress that is very different from what you are used to that there will usually be an adjustment period during the first few weeks.

1-is it normal to feel aching moving form one bed to another?


It's very common yes.

2-should i go back to the soft top and hope i can handle it? my lower back had no problems with it.but dont think my neck was well supported but it could have just been a pillow problem


It would make sense to me to try it for more than a few days IMO and see if the neck issues can be "fixed" with a different pillow.

3-sometimes i just want to dump this and return to tempur but would waste 4 grand?


These are the types of decisions that only you can decide what to do but if it was me I would certainly do whatever I could to try and make a new mattress "work" before walking away from a purchase that large.

4- its christmas so they left me for 7 days on this medium ,and can change back to soft in 7 days


At least that will give you a little longer to test your current configuration.

5-the latex solved the moving problem but i feel awful my lower back is tight i am not used to support but this bed is pretty soft


Again ... I would always keep in mind that you need "enough" firmness in the deeper layers to "stop" the heavier parts of your body from sinking down too far and "enough" softness in your upper layers to "allow" your shoulders and the lighter parts of your body to sink in enough to fill in the gaps in your sleeping profile and provide the pressure relief that you need.

6-everything is stiff when I wake and I am struggling.
7- I dont get much time to try layers so wonder if my body will adjust to this?


These are questions that can only be answered based on your own experience and on the effect of time and the different combinations you are trying and whether your symptoms seem to be diminishing, staying the same, or getting worse ... but at least you have the chance to make some fine tuning adjustments to your mattress so you can make a "best judgement" decision about whether you will get used to it over time based on your actual experience.

8 even with soft top remember this latex is 11 inches so i have lots of support.


While thicker mattresses can be a good idea with heavier weights to keep you from bottoming out ... once again I would keep in mind that PPP and good alignment comes from the combination of layers in the mattress ... not the thickness itself.

9-im a side sleeper and i need some pressure point relief badly finding the medium top to hard even tho i am very fat and it gives support.


Side sleepers generally need more thickness/softness in the upper layers of their mattress than back or stomach sleepers to provide good pressure relief but the key is always "just enough" in terms of thickness/softness so that there is less risk of compromising good alignment ... particularly in your other sleeping positions.

10- i have a condo and can only have one bed.so must decide.why does my lower back ache when i get up?even on medium on soft i dont feel it.this is a premium bed and i hate to get rid of it ,,,aim trying to adjust but not sleeping too well HELP!


Hopefully this has helped with some of the "detective work" or trial and error that may be necessary to decide on which configuration has the best chance of success.

Phoenix
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desperately need help with a hand -made talalay latex bed,please 25 Dec 2014 15:10 #3

Thank you that was helpful,I am not sure if i mentioned that i have fibro ,so I am a hurting machine here.

I will try it without the topper and see but I am kind of sure I need to go back to the soft top layer.I thought everyone with fibro needed a soft top layer.

I am unsure if they only allow one more change I hope not cause i would like to try the soft again Without the topper!

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Last edit: by kayla.

desperately need help with a hand -made talalay latex bed,please 26 Dec 2014 09:43 #4

Hi kayla,

I will try it without the topper and see but I am kind of sure I need to go back to the soft top layer.I thought everyone with fibro needed a soft top layer.

You are very kind to write ,can you tell me if its true everyone with fibro should have soft on top in latex?


Almost everyone needs a softer top layer in their sleeping system to provide the pressure relief they need and to isolate them from the firmness of the support system in their mattress. Firmness and softness are also very subjective though and relative to the body type, sleeping positions, and individual preferences and sensitivity of each person so a mattress that feels firm to some people can feel soft to someone else so the thickness and softness of the comfort layers that works best for a specific person will depend on the person and the overall design of the mattress. Most people with fibromyalgia are more sensitive to pressure issues so having a mattress that has softer and more pressure relieving comfort layers would be even more important than the norm. As you read in the previous posts I linked about wool toppers ... foam layers (latex or otherwise) can be softer than wool and a wool topper can "firm up" softer latex layers underneath it but it is also less resilient than latex and provides a more "relaxed" sleeping surface and is also more breathable and temperature regulating than latex and both of these can also be important for some people who have fibromyalgia.

There is just simply no place for my shoulders to go.


As I mentioned in my last reply ... based on your previous comments it would make sense to me to retry the softer layer.

I had virtually no pain in the tempur but I can see it wasn't giving me-the greatest support either...and moving ,even with an adjustable was impossible.Yet if this doesn't work I will have to go back.


If you were sleeping pain free on the Tempurpedic then it sounds like the support/alignment was suitable for you. Is there a reason that lead you to believe that it wasn't?

The "stuck in the sand" feeling and motion restriction (to different degrees depending on the type of memory foam) of most slow response and temperature sensitive materials is one of their normal properties and is one of the reasons that some people like memory foam and some people don't like it at all.

Im frustrated ,stiff and a part of me as i said just wants to dump it.I know its such an expensive experiment.Im going to ask to try the soft again when they return form christmas ,,,but even 4 more days of this seems rough to me.

you were very kind to reply but at times i think this is hopeless ,my body is too sensitive to try these things out.
I just want to give up but i won't ,will try the soft again and hope if it doesn't work they will allow me to go back to medium.



Given your circumstances and the importance of sleeping well it would certainly make sense to me to put some significant time and effort into finding a configuration that will work well for you before walking away from a $4000 purchase.

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
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Last edit: by phoenix.

desperately need help with a hand -made talalay latex bed,please 26 Dec 2014 10:05 #5

I certainly appreciate your timely responses.You are a very kind person.

Kayla

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Last edit: by kayla.

desperately need help with a hand -made talalay latex bed,please 26 Dec 2014 11:42 #6

Hi kayla,

I think what upsets me about these bedmakers is that they never responded to anything.I mean people still need to sleep thru the holidays right?

And what was even more suspicious was the fact they required a certified check for 1/2 payment and then also on delivery.why certified?its not like I was going to hobble to Mexico on a broken knee right?


While I don't know the specifics of who you are dealing with ... there are many businesses that are closed over the holidays and this would just be a business choice that they make. It would probably be more common with smaller manufacturers to close over holidays so they can also spend time with their families.

There are also many custom manufacturers that require some type of payment ahead of time before they will build a custom mattress so that a customer doesn't change their mind and cancel the order and leave them stuck with a mattress or materials that they may not be able to sell to someone else although if the only method of payment they accept was a certified cheque (most companies accept credit cards) this would be somewhat unusual and I would be curious why this was the case. Most companies require payment in full before they will build a mattress and then they would deliver or ship it when it was completed (which in some cases can be several weeks later).

Neither of these would be unusual or "suspicious" by themselves and they are just business decisions that each business makes as part of their overall business plan. If any of these policies aren't something that a customer is comfortable with then they always have the option to do business somewhere else that has different business policies that they are more comfortable with. This is all part of the many factors that are part of the "value" of a mattress purchase that each person needs to decide on their importance for themselves as part of their personal value equation before they make a purchase ... not after it (see post #13 here for more about the most important parts of the "value" of a mattress purchase).

And they advertise fitting beds for difficult to fit people.


With the layer exchange they are offering it sounds to me like they are doing this.

I would like them to just take the bed back and forget it but they seem rather money hungry and perhaps just in it for that reason.


If you purchased a mattress that has no return policy then this would be what you agreed to when you made the purchase and it certainly wouldn't make them "money hungry" to keep to the terms of the purchase agreement that you agreed to when you made the purchase. This would be part of the research that a consumer is responsible for before they make a purchase.

The total cost with tax was almost 4,400 so they are unlikely to return anything even tho they can use those latex layers.

I am not a happy camper but perhaps it is my own fault.The bed industry seems rather seedy at times.
not sure what to do now but at least have some relief when I get the tempur back.That also cost 150 to move so it was an expensive lesson?


A mattress manufacturer can't use used layers in a mattress and sell it as a new mattress and this would be against the law in most places in North America. A return policy would also be built in to the cost of a mattress purchase (see post #25 here ) so I don't think it would be reasonable to expect a manufacturer to accept returns after the fact when their pricing doesn't include the cost of a return policy when they sell it. With return or exchange policies the customers that don't return or exchange their mattress are the ones that pay for the ones that do so there are many people that are quite comfortable buying a mattress where they are confident that the mattress they choose is a good match for them and are happy with the lower cost that can be the result of a retailer or manufacturer not offering a return policy. There is more about return policies in post #3 here and the other posts it links to.

While I agree with you that some parts of the industry can be "seedy" ... I don't think that any of the policies that you are mentioning are all that unusual or would put them in this category and these types of considerations would all be part of the research that a consumer is responsible for before they make a purchase. I think you may be "giving up" too quickly when you still have some good options available to you.

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
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Last edit: by phoenix.

desperately need help with a hand -made talalay latex bed,please 26 Dec 2014 15:57 #7

Do you know what ILD the mattress makers called the soft layer and the medium layer?

A little more than a year ago, I bought the softest Dunlop mattress I could find. It drove me crazy for months - not enough pressure relief for me. I finally added a 3" Talalay topper that was 14 or 15 ILD, and that made all the difference. I sleep really well now, and what many people would think "too soft" is just right for me. I'm also older with fibro and other chronic pain problems.

I'd been sleeping on a soft sided waterbed before switching to latex, with a featherbed on top of the waterbed because it had gotten to feeling too firm for me. On that bed, I was sleeping on 2-3 rather firm down pillows. WIth the latex bed, I had to change to just one of the Cozy Pure LaNoodle pillows to be comfortable - any more pillow than that and my back was out of alignment. I really think at least part of your problem may be pillow related, and I hope you can give the soft top layer another chance. I would be interested in knowing what ILD these folks think is "soft", since the words "soft" and "medium" can be pretty subjective.

Good luck with the mattress - and the knee. :)

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