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Boy am I tired...Help with near-future mattress purchase 05 Jan 2015 11:42 #1

Dear Folks:
I have been having a great time the last couple of days reading through everything on this and other sites (By-the-by, this forum and site are the best by far!). I have read the How-tos, the why-tos, and what-tos. However, at the end of the day, I'm just in desperate need of sleep...something I'm not sure I've had for a long time.

So here's the story...like most middle-aged couples my wife and I have never agreed on a mattress...in 18 years, we've gone through at least six, and probably more (I'm sure I lost count). 7 years ago I bought what I thought was a good deal on a memory foam from Overstock...it lasted three months before it started to breakdown (sigh)...5 years ago we sprung for a Sleep-Number Special Edition (yeah, I'm that idiot), and I'm pretty sure I haven't slept since.

I'm in need of something sooner than later. Listening to Wait Wait Don't Tell me podcast introduced me to Casper...a Google search found reviews and a few comments...and most importantly brought me here to TMU. To be clear, I'm not looking to buy a Casper ('m also not not looking to by one)...but it is what I was researching to get here.

SO! Here's what I need...a way for my wife and I to sleep in the same bed. She is 5'6", 145lbs, a serious weightlifter, professional massage therapist, a side-sleeper, and a morning person. I am 6'0", 300lbs, a former weightlifter with injuries, spa owner and part-time magician, and while originally a back sleeper, I am now a whatever sleeper who just can't catch a break on this Sleep-Number thing. Obviously, I need a LOT more support than she does, but I also want her to be happy (I'm nice like that).

Question #1: Is a Casper, Lessa, or T&N going to support MY large self (I suspect she'd be fine on them based on all the feedback I've read)? Is there another manufacturer I should be looking at?

Question #2: Is there a smart way to buy for two VERY different body types?

Issue #1: My wife HATES shopping, and we both work (own a spa) about 60-80 hours a week, so online is very appealing.

Issue #2: While we would prefer a "quick fix" I understand that probably isn't reasonable, and I'll take any recommendations near 47408.

In advance, thank YOU for any ideas, direction, or feedback. And thank you ALL for such a great forum, I've enjoyed my readings!

Jim

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Boy am I tired...Help with near-future mattress purchase 05 Jan 2015 13:23 #2

Hi Jim,

Phoenix will no doubt offer a more detailed reply (he has tons of links to various conversations on this forum for different topics), but I can add a few things based on my experience. My husband and I have been looking for a new mattress for a while. We purchased a Sleep Number late last summer, then a Casper. Both ultimately went back. I am thankful for both companies' return policies, though I do regret having lost some money on the Sleep Number in delivery fees, return fees (I paid extra for a home pick-up, because we didn't have the original boxes and I just wanted to get it over with), and some of the bedding that is no longer useful. But better some money lost than a lot of money if I hadn't returned the bed in time. It seems like you probably know the downsides of Sleep Number, though, so I won't go into that.

I do think that the Casper will probably not be suitable for you. It used to say on their site that the weight limit was 450lbs total. I can't find it now, so I don't know if they've changed their guidance or it's no longer listed, or I just plain can't find it. I am 270 and my husband is 205, and while he was relatively comfortable in the Casper, I found I sank in too much. Especially when the weather was warmer, which I suspect was due to the memory foam component. I believe Phoenix has also pointed out that the density of the memory foam layer is a little on the low end durability-wise, especially for those of higher weights,

Everyone can be different, though, so I can't say for sure if your experience would be the same. The best source of the most up-to-date and accurate information would be to talk to Casper themselves. I will say that they were super nice every time I talked to them (via web chat) and they happily arranged a pick-up for the mattress to be donated, then refunded my money after the pick-up. Free delivery, free pick-up, and a hundred night trial does make them pretty risk free except for your time and needing to shuffle mattresses around.

I don't have personal experience with Tuft & Needle, but they did come up in my research. At the time, their design didn't sound like something I wanted to try, but their site does say that the weight limit for their 10 inch mattress is 500lbs per side, so there's that. They have a new design now that sounds more interesting, but we've already made our next choice.

I think that even with different weights, a couple might find a single mattress that both like, depending on their sleeping preferences, but if that doesn't happen, some places do offer side-to-side zoning options. I have seen this mainly in the latex mattresses (and air beds, of course), but I think there are other designs out there. We went with a split latex model from an online source (Flobeds), which just arrived today so I can't speak to it yet.

Phoenix won't tell you what to buy (rightfully so, I think. Many parts of mattress buying are too subjective), but he's very helpful in learning how to ask the right questions and learning what sort of options are out there.

I do believe that getting some testing in on various types of mattresses is a really good idea if you can manage it. We didn't have any experience with latex previously, so while I thought the material sounded interesting on paper, I wasn't sure if we'd actually like it. There weren't any mattresses locally that are exactly like the Flobeds vZone we ordered, but we tried enough latex models of various sorts that I think we at least have a good chance that we will like the feel of it. I had a couple phone conversations with them before ordering in order to use their expertise on the firmness choices to get the best chance for starting out and they have some options for tweaking after purchase. And if we turn out not to like it after all, they also have a good return policy (again, some shipping fees to and fro that would be lost, but that's a risk I'm willing to take).

There are a lot of options out there, so try not to drive yourself too crazy. I think we probably could have done even more local testing, but I feel we at least got enough variety in to give us some direction in our search.

Good luck!

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Boy am I tired...Help with near-future mattress purchase 05 Jan 2015 14:40 #3

Hi Kep!,

Outside of Tamarack's great comments and suggestions (thanks tamaracks :)) ... I can add some additional information and links that may also be helpful (some of which you've probably read already from reading the tutorial).

SO! Here's what I need...a way for my wife and I to sleep in the same bed. She is 5'6", 145lbs, a serious weightlifter, professional massage therapist, a side-sleeper, and a morning person. I am 6'0", 300lbs, a former weightlifter with injuries, spa owner and part-time magician, and while originally a back sleeper, I am now a whatever sleeper who just can't catch a break on this Sleep-Number thing. Obviously, I need a LOT more support than she does, but I also want her to be happy (I'm nice like that).


Post #3 here and the posts it links to has more information and guidelines that will be helpful for those that are in higher weight ranges.

There are also some suggestions in the first part of post #2 here that will be helpful for couples that have very different body types and have very different needs and preferences.

Question #1: Is a Casper, Lessa, or T&N going to support MY large self (I suspect she'd be fine on them based on all the feedback I've read)? Is there another manufacturer I should be looking at?


While I can't speak to whether any of these will be a good match for you in terms of PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) because the only way to know this would be based on your own personal experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here ) ... I can certainly make some comments about the materials in each mattress.

This topic also has more about Casper, Leesa, and Tuft & Needle (and some of the other new entrants in this category as well).

Brooklyn Bedding uses 2" of blended Talalay latex over 2" of synthetic Dunlop latex over a 6" 2.0 lb density polyfoam which are all very high quality materials and it's unusual to find 4" of premium foams in a mattress in this category. Their 2 lb polyfoam base layer is also a higher density than the norm in this category and these materials would all be suitable and durable enough for higher weight ranges without any "qualifications".

The Kiss mattress by SleepEZ uses 1.5" of blended Talalay latex over 1.5" of 4 lb float foam which is a high performance polyfoam that has some of the properties and contouring of memory foam without the lack of resilience and slow response of memory foam over 7" of 2 lb polyfoam which is also a higher density than the norm in this category and would also be suitable for higher weight ranges without any qualifications.

Tuft & Needle uses 3" of 2.8 lb polyfoam in the comfort layer which would be suitable for your weight range but also uses 1.8 lb polyfoam in the support core which would be a little lower density than I would be comfortable with as well (I would generally look for 2 lb density or higher in the support core in your weight range) but since only the deeper layer is a little lower density than the guidelines I would suggest for higher weight ranges it would be a little less risky than most of the others that also have some medium quality/density layers on top of the support core as well.

The Love Bed by Nest Bedding uses 3" of convoluted synthetic Dunlop over a 7" 2 lb convoluted base layer which are also higher quality/density materials than you would normally find in this category. It also has a quilted cover with 1" to 1.5" of polyfoam in the quilting. These are all high quality materials that would also be suitable for higher weight ranges without any qualifications.

Casper uses 1.5" of synthetic latex in the top layer but has 1.5" of 4 lb memory foam in the middle layer and a 1.8 lb polyfoam base layer which are both lower density than I would be comfortable with in your weight range (although they would certainly be suitable for lower weight ranges than yours).

Leesa ( see here ) also uses 2" of 3 lb memory foam which would be a weak link in their mattress IMO even for weight ranges that are lower than yours..

Yogabed uses .75" of 5 lb high performance polyfoam but the next layer down is 1.75" of 4 lb memory foam and a 1.8 lb density polyfoam base layer which again are both lower densities than I would be comfortable with in your weight range.

4Sleep uses 1.5" of 3.5 lb gel memory foam over 1" of 3 lb high performance polyfoam over 1.5" of high performance polyfoam over a 7" 1.8 lb polyfoam support core. While there would be no weak links in this mattress for more average weight ranges (lower 200's or less) ... with the 1.5" of 3.5 lb polyfoam and the 1.8 lb polyfoam in the support core these would be lower quality/density than I would be comfortable with in higher weight ranges such as yours.

Question #1: Is a Casper, Lessa, or T&N going to support MY large self (I suspect she'd be fine on them based on all the feedback I've read)? Is there another manufacturer I should be looking at?

Issue #2: While we would prefer a "quick fix" I understand that probably isn't reasonable, and I'll take any recommendations near 47408.


The better options I'm aware of in and around the Bloomington, IN area are listed in post #2 here and the Indianapolis list that it links to as well.

The tutorial post also includes several links to lists of the better online retailers and manufacturers I'm aware of (in the optional online step) and many of these make mattresses that would certainly be suitable for your weight in terms of the quality of the materials and some also have side by side split layers available as well.

Question #2: Is there a smart way to buy for two VERY different body types?


See the previous link and post #2 here also has more about the different ways to choose a mattress (local or online) and how to minimize the risks involved with each of them.

Issue #1: My wife HATES shopping, and we both work (own a spa) about 60-80 hours a week, so online is very appealing.


Online can certainly be appealing to many people as long as you realize that the only way to know for certain whether any mattress will be a good match for you in terms of PPP will be based on your actual sleeping experience so the options you have both before and after a purchase to customize your mattress or exchange it (or return it) will likely become a more important part of the "value" of your purchase. There is more about the most important parts of the "value" of a mattress purchase in post #13 here that can help you make more meaningful comparisons between mattresses and there is also more about the pros and cons of an online purchase vs a local purchase in post #2 here and this topic .

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
For any mattress questions Ask An Expert on our forum

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Last edit: by Phoenix.

Boy am I tired...Help with near-future mattress purchase 05 Jan 2015 14:48 #4

TamaraCK!
Thank you for such a detailed and personal reply! It sounds like you have been where I am, under similar size issues, so your input is really invaluable. Yes, the sinking question is exactly what I was concerned with Casper, so you may have answered that for me...but I'll call them to be sure. Meanwhile, I like the idea of a split bed, so I'll check that out too. Again, Thank YOU!

Kep!

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Boy am I tired...Help with near-future mattress purchase 05 Jan 2015 14:57 #5

Phoenix!

Phoenix wrote:
Casper uses synthetic latex (which is less "supportive" than natural latex) and has 4 lb memory foam in the middle layer and a 1.8 lb polyfoam base layer which are both lower density than I would be comfortable with in your weight range (although they would certainly be suitable for lower weight ranges than yours).

Leesa ( see here ) also uses 2" of 3 lb memory foam which would be a weak link in their mattress IMO.

Tuft & Needle uses 3" of 2.8 lb polyfoam in the comfort layer which would be suitable for your weight range but also uses 1.8 lb polyfoam in the support corre which would be a little lower density than I would be comfortable with as well (I would generally look for 2 lb density or higher in the support core in your weight range).


FANTASTIC! This is exactly the information I needed. A straight opinion on whether it's too weak or not for my largess. BRILLIANT!

As to the rest, once again THANK YOU! This gives me a lot to go on...and off to go on it I am! HOORAY! I can see sleep in my future!

Kep!

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Boy am I tired...Help with near-future mattress purchase 05 Jan 2015 14:59 #6

Phoenix,

To follow up on your breakdown of Casper vs. Leesa vs. T&N...

Do you think that lower density memory foam layer of the Leesa would be a weak link because it is less durable, or because it won't provide as much support/comfort? We've had a Casper for a month, and I have found that I can't really sense the benefits or comfort of the memory foam - possibly because it is too thin?

When I ordered the Casper, Leesa had yet to launch and T&N had yet to announce their newer design. Now that we've determined that the Casper isn't really working for us, I am trying to determine if either of those two might be a good option for us, with pressure relief and cool sleeping being top priorities. Thanks!

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Boy am I tired...Help with near-future mattress purchase 05 Jan 2015 15:17 #7

Caldawa:
I'm glad you thought to ask these questions, I should have too! Thanks! With the new T&N design, it sounds like it's a strong maybe for us...but I'm quickly moving away from the others based on Phoenix's and other's feedback.

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Boy am I tired...Help with near-future mattress purchase 05 Jan 2015 16:43 #8

Hi Caldawa,

You can see some of my comments in reply to your questions in another topic in my reply in post #244 here .

Do you think that lower density memory foam layer of the Leesa would be a weak link because it is less durable, or because it won't provide as much support/comfort? We've had a Casper for a month, and I have found that I can't really sense the benefits or comfort of the memory foam - possibly because it is too thin?


The only way to know with any certainty whether any mattress is a good match for you in terms of PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) is based on your own personal testing or sleeping experience so the suitability of a mattress or how it feels or performs for any individual person isn't a weak link ... its just a matter of the fact that different designs work better or worse for different people with different body types, different sleeping positions, and different sensitivities and preferences no matter what the type or quality of the materials or components in a mattress may be.

A weak link is about the quality/durability of the materials in a mattress relative to the person sleeping on it. You can't "feel" the quality or durability of the materials in a mattress so the only way to know this would be by making sure that you know the type and density of all the foam layers because lower quality and less durable materials can feel the same as higher quality and more durable materials when they are new ... they just don't maintain their comfort and/or support for nearly as long.

There is more about the most important parts of the "value" of a mattress purchase in post #13 here but it comes down to ...

1. Testing a mattress for suitability and PPP (either in a store or when you sleep on a mattress in person).

2. Checking for durability (see this article and the guidelines it links to).

3. Comparing your finalists for "value" based on all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you (including the price and the options you have both before and after a purchase).

When I ordered the Casper, Leesa had yet to launch and T&N had yet to announce their newer design. Now that we've determined that the Casper isn't really working for us, I am trying to determine if either of those two might be a good option for us, with pressure relief and cool sleeping being top priorities. Thanks!


Only you can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved for anyone to reliably predict whether any mattress will be a good "match" for you based on specs (either yours or a mattress) or "theory at a distance (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here ) and the only way to know this will be based on your own personal testing or sleeping experience. This is why the options you have after a purchase to fine tune or exchange the mattress or return it are a much more important part of the "value" of a mattress purchase when you can't test a mattress in person.

The cost of the exchange and return policies are a "hidden cost" that is built into the cost of a mattress so that the people who don't exchange or return a mattress are paying for the ones who do (see post #3 here and the posts it links to).

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
For any mattress questions Ask An Expert on our forum

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Boy am I tired...Help with near-future mattress purchase 05 Jan 2015 18:31 #9

With such a large weight difference between you two i'd recomend some kind of system were both sides of the bed can be changed. Like Sleep EZ 10000, or Arizona Adjustable, sleep ez is more adjustable though. Expensive option though (2k) for a king.

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Last edit: by Elderblaze.

Boy am I tired...Help with near-future mattress purchase 05 Jan 2015 20:34 #10

Phoenix wrote: A weak link is about the quality/durability of the materials in a mattress relative to the person sleeping on it. You can't "feel" the quality or durability of the materials in a mattress so the only way to know this would be by making sure that you know the type and density of all the foam layers because lower quality and less durable materials can feel the same as higher quality and more durable materials when they are new ... they just don't maintain their comfort and/or support for nearly as long.


I see what you're saying. An inner layer that wears out too quickly wouldn't be ideal.

Phoenix wrote: Only you can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved for anyone to reliably predict whether any mattress will be a good "match" for you based on specs (either yours or a mattress) or "theory at a distance (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here ) and the only way to know this will be based on your own personal testing or sleeping experience. This is why the options you have after a purchase to fine tune or exchange the mattress or return it are a much more important part of the "value" of a mattress purchase when you can't test a mattress in person.

The cost of the exchange and return policies are a "hidden cost" that is built into the cost of a mattress so that the people who don't exchange or return a mattress are paying for the ones who do (see post #3 here and the posts it links to).


Very true...I don't regret taking a chance on the Casper, even if it hasn't worked out for our particular needs like we hope. Thanks again for answering all my questions!

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Last edit: by caldwa. Reason: Fixed quotes
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