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A couple of questions on brands and split-king adjustable mattresses 27 Jul 2015 23:31 #1

Same song, different verse from another mattress searcher: I've been reading the forum a good bit the last week or so, and I've learned a lot, but the more I learn, the more unsure I become. Here's my particular situation:
I went to a local mattress store (small town) called "Your Mattress Matters" - they deal in Southerland mattresses. I found two that I liked - Discovery Gel and Symphony Box Pillow Top. After reading these forums, I knew I needed to ask them about the materials, and after asking 3 times, here's what I finally got:
Discovery Gel:
- Bamboo 4-way Stretch Knit Cover
- Quilted Fire Retardant Barrier
- 3" of 3lb Gel-Infused Open-Cell memory foam
- 7" of high density performance foam.
From researching here, I think I'm right in assuming Phoenix is going to say that the 3" of 3lb foam on the top layer is a weak link.

Symphony:
- FR Fiber
- Supersoft Foam
- Latex Lumbar Support
- Gel-Infused Memory Foam
- Supersoft Foam
- Foam Encased Wrapped Coil Unit
No specifics were given as to the foam density or thicknesses, so this one is hard to judge. I read on the article about biggest mattress companies that Southerland is a mixed bag with their transparency and disclosure of construction details.

Both felt good in the showroom. Both were around $1000 for a King. I was impressed with the 15 year warranty and especially the 0.75" indentation criteria for warranty, which seems to me to be twice as good as every other mattress company I've come across, who all say 1.5" indentation for warranty. I am looking to get a split-king adjustable. One thing I'm worried about with the split-king adjustable is that my wife and I won't be able to cuddle in the middle or will feel a crack in the middle and will end up having to basically sleep on separate beds just situated beside each other. The salesman said that he sleeps on this and that it's not a problem, as these are specifically designed as a split-king rather than just putting two twin-xl's together. I think he meant that they are one unit in the middle and only split on the head and foot adjustable portions. He also said that the foam makes this a non-issue as it spreads into itself and makes the unit feel like one bed with no crack in the middle when both are lying flat.

So, then I come home and become obsessed researching mattresses and end up on this forum. After searching for a while, I've been seriously considering the Nest Alexander. I talked to someone over the phone and they said they don't sell a specifically designed split-king adjustable but I would just have to order two twiin-xl's.

I think I'm down to two things:
1. Can anyone give advice on my concerns with the split-king adjustable issue with the crack in the middle? Would a specifically designed split-king be a lot better than two separate twins put together as a split-king? Why can I not find the split-king adjustable specific designs in any of the highly recommended mattress lines given on this forum?

2. What do you think about my process so far? Am I right in looking away from the Southerland and toward the Nest Alexander? I also looked at the sleepEZ configurable beds, but it seemed a bit too complicated and expensive. Should I just go with the Southerlands since I liked them in the showroom and they have the good warranty and indentation criteria and I like doing business locally?

Here is my background/details: I have a herniated disc in the lower back (been going on since last October) which is the primary reason for my new mattress purchase. My old mattress is about 10 years old and is sagging in the middle, and I'm noticing pain with sleeping and wake up with pain in the morning that subsides as I move around. I have better experiences when I sleep in hotels with good mattresses. I feel sure that I will see a big improvement from any of the mattress choices I've read about on here or with the Southerlands as well, as it wouldn't take much for improvement. Also, if it helps, I'm 6'1", 200lbs. My wife is 5'9", 125lbs. I appreciate the info and chance to have this conversation on here and would welcome any suggestions/input/ideas for my search.

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Last edit: by vamosjackets.

A couple of questions on brands and split-king adjustable mattresses 28 Jul 2015 07:56 #2

I am also concerned about the split king "crack," but we are getting an adjustable bed base and I know that my husband and I will sleep with different head elevations most of the time. The different elevations will hinder cuddling, with or without the crack. I figure we will find a solution. He always seems to find a way to hang onto me...

I did want to mention to you that I have ordered a memory foam bed with Novosbed. I bought the Aria model. They offer a 25 year warranty that has a .5 indention max for the first five years and .75 for the remaining twenty years. 100% replacement for the entire twenty-five years. I haven't seen that strong of a warranty with any other mattress yet. Now, I haven't gotten the mattress yet, and the one I ordered has been delayed due to a redesign of the airflow channel so I won't be able to review it until next month. I will share my experiences when I am able.

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A couple of questions on brands and split-king adjustable mattresses 28 Jul 2015 08:06 #3

Hi vamosjackets,

Discovery Gel:
- Bamboo 4-way Stretch Knit Cover
- Quilted Fire Retardant Barrier
- 3" of 3lb Gel-Infused Open-Cell memory foam
- 7" of high density performance foam.
From researching here, I think I'm right in assuming Phoenix is going to say that the 3" of 3lb foam on the top layer is a weak link.


You're absolutely right ... I would consider the 3" of 3 lb memory foam to be a weak link in this mattress.

Symphony:
- FR Fiber
- Supersoft Foam
- Latex Lumbar Support
- Gel-Infused Memory Foam
- Supersoft Foam
- Foam Encased Wrapped Coil Unit
No specifics were given as to the foam density or thicknesses, so this one is hard to judge. I read on the article about biggest mattress companies that Southerland is a mixed bag with their transparency and disclosure of construction details.


If a retailer or manufacturer is either unable or unwilling to provide you with the specs you need to make an informed choice about the durability of the mattress I would avoid it completely. It's almost certain that the supersoft foam and/or the gel infused memory foam would be low density and would be a weak link in the mattress. I treat "low quality/density" and "unknown quality/density" as the same thing because they almost always are.

Both felt good in the showroom. Both were around $1000 for a King. I was impressed with the 15 year warranty and especially the 0.75" indentation criteria for warranty, which seems to me to be twice as good as every other mattress company I've come across, who all say 1.5" indentation for warranty. I am looking to get a split-king adjustable.


Mattress warranties only cover manufacturing defects in a mattress and they don't cover foam softening and the loss of comfort and support that goes with it (which is considered to be "normal" and not a defect) and the loss of comfort and/or support is generally the main reason that you would need to buy a new mattress. Warranties have little to nothing to do with the durability or useful life of a mattress and longer warranties are more about marketing than anything else (see post #174 here ).

The salesman said that he sleeps on this and that it's not a problem, as these are specifically designed as a split-king rather than just putting two twin-xl's together. I think he meant that they are one unit in the middle and only split on the head and foot adjustable portions. He also said that the foam makes this a non-issue as it spreads into itself and makes the unit feel like one bed with no crack in the middle when both are lying flat.

So, then I come home and become obsessed researching mattresses and end up on this forum. After searching for a while, I've been seriously considering the Nest Alexander. I talked to someone over the phone and they said they don't sell a specifically designed split-king adjustable but I would just have to order two twiin-xl's.

I think I'm down to two things:
1. Can anyone give advice on my concerns with the split-king adjustable issue with the crack in the middle? Would a specifically designed split-king be a lot better than two separate twins put together as a split-king? Why can I not find the split-king adjustable specific designs in any of the highly recommended mattress lines given on this forum?


A split eastern king adjustable bed or mattress and two twin XL adjustable beds or mattresses are exactly the same thing (whether you are referring to the adjustable bed itself or a split mattress to go on top of it). Adjustable beds don't come in a single eastern king size and are only sold as split king sizes (two twin XL adjustable beds). They can generally be programmed to operate together with a single remote or each side can operate independently. You can use either a king size mattress or two twin XL mattresses on a split king adjustable bed.

If the "crack" you are concerned about refers to the adjustable bed itself then you wouldn't be able to feel it under the mattress.

If you are concerned with the crack in between the mattresses themselves then whether you feel the crack in the middle and how much you feel it would depend on the specific design of the mattress and whether the top edges are flush to each other, the body type and sleeping positions of the people sleeping on it, and on how and where you sleep. There are some comments in post #8 here and in this topic that should help you decide on whether the pros and cons of a split king mattress are worth it to you.

2. What do you think about my process so far? Am I right in looking away from the Southerland and toward the Nest Alexander? I also looked at the sleepEZ configurable beds, but it seemed a bit too complicated and expensive. Should I just go with the Southerlands since I liked them in the showroom and they have the good warranty and indentation criteria and I like doing business locally?


I would avoid both of the Southerlands you were looking at unless you can find out the quality/density of the foam layers in the second one and confirm that it doesn't have any lower quality materials or weak links in the design (which it probably does).

The Nest Bedding Alexander uses good quality materials and there are no lower quality materials or weak links in the mattress relative to your body weight so it would certainly be worth considering.

There is more about the most important parts of the "value" of a mattress purchase in post #13 here but it comes down to suitability and PPP (which is all about how well you will sleep), the quality/durability of the materials inside it (which is all about how long you will sleep well before you need to replace the mattress) and value (which is all about how your mattress compares to all your other finalists based on PPP and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are important to you). It seems that you are taking all three (suitability, durability, and value) into account and the only comment I would make is that I really wouldn't consider any mattress where you don't have the information you need to assess the durability and useful life of the mattress.

The SleepEZ mattress is very simple to assemble and of course uses latex which is a higher quality and more costly and durable material which is the reason it's in a higher budget range (it's certainly less than many other similar mattresses) but it's also great "value". Component mattresses such as the SleepEZ latex mattresses also have the advantage of being able to customize the comfort and support of the mattress both before and after a purchase and to replace individual layers if one layer softens or breaks down before the others (usually the softer top layer) or if your needs or preferences change over time but of course if a mattress is outside your budget range then it probably wouldn't be worth considering regardless of its quality, durability, or value.

Here is my background/details: I have a herniated disc in the lower back (been going on since last October) which is the primary reason for my new mattress purchase. My old mattress is about 10 years old and is sagging in the middle, and I'm noticing pain with sleeping and wake up with pain in the morning that subsides as I move around. I have better experiences when I sleep in hotels with good mattresses. I feel sure that I will see a big improvement from any of the mattress choices I've read about on here or with the Southerlands as well, as it wouldn't take much for improvement. Also, if it helps, I'm 6'1", 200lbs. My wife is 5'9", 125lbs. I appreciate the info and chance to have this conversation on here and would welcome any suggestions/input/ideas for my search.


I don't make specific suggestions or recommendations for either a mattress, manufacturers/retailers, or materials because the first "rule" of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress. There are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components would be the best "match" for you in terms of "comfort" or PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) or how a mattress will "feel" to you based on specs (either yours or a mattress) or "theory at a distance" that can possibly be more accurate than your own careful testing (using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here ).

There is more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best "match" for you in terms of PPP in post #2 here that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn't turn out as well as you hoped for once you actually sleep on your mattress but when you are making an online purchase and can't test a mattress in person then the most reliable source of guidance is always a more detailed phone conversation with a knowledgeable and experienced retailer or manufacturer that has your best interests at heart (such as Nest Bedding) who can help "talk you through" the specifics of their mattresses and the options they have available that may be the best "match" for you based on the information you provide them, any local testing you have done or mattresses you have slept on and liked that they are familiar with, any special considerations or health issues you may have, and the "averages" of other customers that are similar to you. They will know more about "matching" their specific mattress designs or firmness options to different body types, sleeping positions, and preferences or even to other mattresses that they are familiar with than anyone else.

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
For any mattress questions Ask An Expert on our forum

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Last edit: by Phoenix.

A couple of questions on brands and split-king adjustable mattresses 29 Jul 2015 12:31 #4

I had edited my original post to reflect that Novosbed was also on my final considerations list along with Nest Alexander and SleepEZ, but I guess somehow that didn't go through.

Thanks for the solid advice so far. I have eliminated the Southerland local dealer option from my finalists.

But, I have complicated the matter in my mind a bit more because of the fear of the SPLIT in split-king. Here is mine and my wife's new idea:
What if we added some sort of topper, be it some sort of thin latex or even wool to go over the two twin-XL's used to create the split-king? Perhaps that would take care of the possible crack issue in the middle. Of course, it would also create an issue for when one person is inclined more than another. I'm thinking that perhaps it would limit the amount of difference of incline the two sides could undergo but would not eliminate that difference all together. Maybe I could be inclined somewhat while my wife laid flat, and, though it may be a bit awkwardly slanted, it might still work. Has anyone else ever thought about that or tried it?

So, with that new idea in mind, I"m thinking about three options:
1. I could go with the SleepEZ split system but with a solid piece on top (rather than split top), which could accomplish the same thing.
2. I could go with the T&N which is significantly cheaper and still well-respected by the critics. From most reviews, it sounds pretty firm, so a softer topper might go well with it.
3. Or, could still just go with the nest alexander and see if the "crack" thing is livable.

Any opinions on these options or with my somewhat odd idea of solid top layer/topper?

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Last edit: by vamosjackets.

A couple of questions on brands and split-king adjustable mattresses 29 Jul 2015 13:55 #5

Hi vamosjackets,

What if we added some sort of topper, be it some sort of thin latex or even wool to go over the two twin-XL's used to create the split-king? Perhaps that would take care of the possible crack issue in the middle. Of course, it would also create an issue for when one person is inclined more than another. I'm thinking that perhaps it would limit the amount of difference of incline the two sides could undergo but would not eliminate that difference all together. Maybe I could be inclined somewhat while my wife laid flat, and, though it may be a bit awkwardly slanted, it might still work. Has anyone else ever thought about that or tried it?


This would be one of the options (along with some of the options in post #8 here ) that can minimize the "feel" of the split between each mattress (if that turns out to be an issue because for some people or some mattresses it wouldn't be an issue at all) but it would also eliminate the ability to operate each side of the adjustable bed independently because you would risk damaging the topper. If each mattress is the same height then a split king mattress or a component mattress inside a single cover would still have the advantage of being able to choose different firmness levels on each side for couples that have different needs and preferences (see the first part of post #2 here along with post #2 here about side to side split mattresses inside a single cover).

So, with that new idea in mind, I"m thinking about three options:
1. I could go with the SleepEZ split system but with a solid piece on top (rather than split top), which could accomplish the same thing.
2. I could go with the T&N which is significantly cheaper and still well-respected by the critics. From most reviews, it sounds pretty firm, so a softer topper might go well with it.
3. Or, could still just go with the nest alexander and see if the "crack" thing is livable.


All of these could certainly make good quality/value choices and there would be no lower quality materials or weak links in any of them although of course they are all very different mattresses.

When you are down to finalists that are all choices between "good and good" and none of them have any lower quality materials or "weak links" in their design and if there are no clear winners between them (which is a good indication that you have done some very good research) then you are in the fortunate position that any of them would likely be a suitable choice and post #2 here can help you make a final choice based on your local testing or mattresses you have slept well on, your more detailed conversations with each of them, your confidence about PPP and the suitability of each one, their prices, your preferences, the options you have after a purchase to fine tune the mattress or exchange or return the mattress or individual layers, any additional extras that are part of each purchase, and on "informed best judgement" based on all the other objective, subjective, and intangible parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
For any mattress questions Ask An Expert on our forum

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Last edit: by Phoenix.

A couple of questions on brands and split-king adjustable mattresses 31 Jul 2015 11:11 #6

Ok, right now, I can't think of a reason NOT to go with the Tuft and Needle. It's highly thought of by the critics and it's the cheapest. And, if it doesn't work, I can always go with a more expensive option later. So, if it does work, I come out ahead, and if it doesn't I haven't lost anything ... Ok, I've convinced myself.

Can anyone think of a reason NOT to give T&N the first shot? That's a serious question, not rhetorical. I'd like to be challenged on this if there is a good one.

Also, with it probably being on the firmer side, I will probably try out some different toppers to add some "plushness" ... probably a wool topper first, maybe even a latex if it's still not where I want it to be ... With that awesome price, I've got plenty left in the budget to dress it up in various ways.

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A couple of questions on brands and split-king adjustable mattresses 31 Jul 2015 11:20 #7

@Geekymom1 : Thanks for the reply. :) The Aria seems like a great choice - I'm pretty much down to that and the T&N. One big reason those two seem like better solutions to me than the Alexander or SleepEZ is that they don't have any seems to contend with in that "crack", so they should fit flush against one another. Also, thanks for the warranty information - that is definitely better than anything else I've seen, if true.

I am going to try a few of the bed "bridges" or "wedges" to also help with the "crack" problem (feel like a drug user saying that ;). This looks like a good concept: www.bedbathandbeyond.com/store/product/instant-king-twin-bed-bridge/1012184352?skuId=12184352&mcid=PS_googlepla_nonbrand_bedding_&adpos=1o2&creative=43742631709&device=c&matchtype=&network=g&gclid=CJSZ64X9hccCFQUGaQodUYsMgQ
Or maybe this: www.amazon.com/Create-Instant-Connector-Unique-Together/dp/B00438S56Q/ref=sr_1_11?s=home-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1438366681&sr=1-11&keywords=mattress+wedge

I don't know how they'll perform if one of us is inclined more than the other - whether they'll kind of just go right back in place when flat again.

I'd love to hear how your experience turns out with the Aria split-king.

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Last edit: by vamosjackets.

A couple of questions on brands and split-king adjustable mattresses 31 Jul 2015 12:16 #8

Vamosjackets: I will definitely report on my mattress experience when I am able. The Aria mattress has undergone a minor design to improve airflow and won't be sent out for a few more weeks as the company awaits more stock of the new design. I also found out that Novosbed will offer a new model with firmness between the Classic and the Aria any day now. Once again they awaiting for enough stock to update their website and take orders for this new model It will be called the Classic II and this weekend my husband and I are going out again to test comparable mattresses because I think he might prefer the extra firmness of the Classic II to the Aria. Both mattresses are 11" (and they do have a 11" Classic in the Twin XL) so we may have mattresses with different firmness next to each other.

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A couple of questions on brands and split-king adjustable mattresses 31 Jul 2015 14:22 #9

Hi vamosjackets,

thanks for the warranty information - that is definitely better than anything else I've seen, if true.


As I mentioned in my previous reply I would keep in mind that a warranty has little to nothing to do with the durability or useful life of a mattress or how long it will be before you need to buy a new one.

Can anyone think of a reason NOT to give T&N the first shot? That's a serious question, not rhetorical. I'd like to be challenged on this if there is a good one.


If a mattress uses good quality materials and there are no lower quality materials or weak links in the design in terms of durability then the only reason "not" to buy a mattress would be either because of ...

1. You prefer different types of materials or mattresses which is a preference choice that only you can decide.

2. You believe you would sleep better on a different mattress but the only way to know this with any certainty would be based on your own personal experience.

3. Because of budget restraints that prevents you from buying a higher priced mattress that you would otherwise choose if it wasn't for the higher price which again is something that only you can decide.

4. Because of any of the other objective, subjective, and intangible parts of your personal value equation that are important to you that would exclude a specific mattress from consideration but once again you are the only one that can decide this.

I am going to try a few of the bed "bridges" or "wedges" to also help with the "crack" problem (feel like a drug user saying that ;). This looks like a good concept: www.bedbathandbeyond.com/store/product/i...X9hccCFQUGaQodUYsMgQ
Or maybe this: www.amazon.com/Create-Instant-Connector-...words=mattress+wedge

I don't know how they'll perform if one of us is inclined more than the other - whether they'll kind of just go right back in place when flat again.


I would keep in mind that none of these are designed to be used with a split king mattress where you would be raising and lowering each side independently of the other.

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
For any mattress questions Ask An Expert on our forum

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Last edit: by Phoenix.

A couple of questions on brands and split-king adjustable mattresses 03 Aug 2015 13:59 #10

I'm getting close to finishing up this decision process. Now, I"m wondering about the adjustable bases (split-King). I read through the adjustable base threads a good bit. I think I've found the best price to be $1200 on a Rize Elevation model, which has no bells and whistles. I didn't see much about the Rize on these forums even when I did a search for them. Are they as good as the L&P or Reverie? Does $1200 sound like the right price for a base model?

I did find a decent deal on a L&P S-Cape for $1699 (delivered but not installed). It's got the massage and presets and cordless remotes, but I don't think those features are worth the extra $500. From reading here, it seems like the massage sounds like a nice feature, but isn't something people just "love" and couldn't live without. My impression is that it's really just about the very basic function of the raising head and legs and there is little point to any other features.

Whiteglove delivery for L&P costs an extra $250. How hard are these things to install? Is the $250 worth it?

Edit to add: Are there discounts on any of the adjustable bases or at any of the adjustable base stores given in other threads from being a member of this site like there are with mattress store members?

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Last edit: by vamosjackets.
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