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Migrating from a sealy beachside (latex) matress

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24 Jul 2017 10:49 #11 by Csj0952
What is going to be the best quality material to encase the latex to help me sleep the coldest? Is wool the best for heat transfer or would a synthetic be better?

Is there a way to measure the quality of talalay latex blends from various manufacturers? It's tough for me to compare pure talalay bliss with sleep ez since they are both talalay blends but beyond that what else do I have to go on ?

Am I looking at the sleep ez 7 or 9 inch or should I just call them.

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24 Jul 2017 19:51 #12 by Phoenix
Hi Csj0952,

What is going to be the best quality material to encase the latex to help me sleep the coldest? Is wool the best for heat transfer or would a synthetic be better?


In my previous reply I linked to an excellent post describing the many variables that can have an overall impact upon your sleeping environment. A thinner cover that is mostly synthetic certainly can be extremely breathable and flexible, as can one that will be quilted to wool. The thicker the covering, the most it can potentially impact the feel of your mattress and also impact the breathability. Both types can be very high quality.

Is there a way to measure the quality of talalay latex blends from various manufacturers? It's tough for me to compare pure talalay bliss with sleep ez since they are both talalay blends but beyond that what else do I have to go on ?


As I mentioned in my previous reply to you (and the post that was linked in that reply stated in more detail) all latex you’re likely to encounter will be an extremely high-quality material, blended or natural. In the western world, you’ll be getting blended Talalay from either Talalay Global (used by Pure Talalay Bliss) or Radium. SleepEZ carries Talalay from both companies, so if you’re curious, I would certainly phone them, which is something I would recommend regardless before placing an order with any company. But I personally wouldn’t have an issue with blended Talalay from either company (both use a 70/30 SBR/NR blend).

Am I looking at the sleep ez 7 or 9 inch or should I just call them.


Yes, I would definitely phone any manufacturer you’re considering before making any purchase, as this is the best way to receive more accurate and complete information in "real time", and also give them the best chance at suggesting a product in their lineup that they think will best suit your particular needs.

Phoenix

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25 Jul 2017 11:59 #13 by Csj0952
Phoenix, last question, i promise. I talked to sleepEz on the phone, I think we have me narrowed down to a 9inch talalay (2 inch comfort layer). I'm not sure I need a 10inch matress at my 155 lb weight. As a stomach sleeper though, they recommend a Medium Medium, Firm config but I'm debating going Soft, medium, firm based on my prior history with matresses. What do you think? They really couldn't tell me which way to go over the other. They did say they could firm up the matress if I went with the soft on top cause you can move it to the middle or bottom layers.

Is it better to try and do the medium medium firm and if it doesn't work then spend the $30 to switch out the medium for a soft later? or should i try the soft off the bat and hope I don't have lower back pain from lack of support?

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25 Jul 2017 13:06 - 08 Aug 2017 13:29 #14 by Phoenix
Hi Csj0952,

I unfortunately can't predict online which configuration might work best for you, as there are entirely too many personal variables involved.

If you decide to go with the 2" plush upper layer, this would be better than going with 3", as for a stomach sleep a firmer surface comfort is generally recommended (hence the SleepEZ recommendation for the medium upper comfort layer), so 2" for a plush would be a "better" plush option as generally recommended by sleep ergonomic researchers. You would also have the ability to rearrange with the softer layer under the top layer, as you mentioned. And if that rearranging didn't work out, you could of course exchange the plush layer for a medium, so ordering the plush will offer you a bit more ability to "experiment".

Phoenix

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Last edit: 08 Aug 2017 13:29 by Phoenix.

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07 Aug 2017 23:14 - 07 Aug 2017 23:16 #15 by Csj0952
Just an update, I've had my mattress since last Thursday. I ordered 9inch with 2inch Soft, 3 inch Medium, 3 inch Firm (all talalay). I set it up the first night as soft on top, medium in the middle and firm on bottom but felt it as plush as my old beachside matress if not more plush. I was disappointed to say the least but figured I'd give it one night in this configuration. Well I slept on it but woke up again in back pain (maybe this could have been residual back pain from prior nights on the older matress but I dunno) and decided to reconfigure the matress putting the soft layer on bottom (essentially hiding it) under the firm layer and then the medium layer on top. This felt a bit better for the first night and i even had a night where i felt my back pain was going away but now it's starting to return again in my lower back. So much so that I'm trying my best to learn how to sleep on my back or on my side and I'm not looking forward to sleeping at night.

I'm starting to wonder if 10 years of sleeping on my stomach on a rather plush mattress has put my back in a bit of a swayback position by default and by putting myself on a medium firm top mattress that I'm forcing it back into a normal position which is causing me some discomfort.

Then again, I'm wondering if I should go back to metro matress and just lay on that pure talaly bliss matress that felt considerably less plush to me than this sleep ez matress.

My plan is to try and stick with the soft on bottom, hard in middle, medium on top configuration for another week and learn to sleep on side or back or whatever to avoid pain taking some advils. Then call sleepez and try and get a recommendation on new foams to reconfigure with. I am told I can make foam replacements for $30 within the first 3 months before i have to decide whether to return the mattress.

My initial thought is to switch my all talalay matress for firm dunlop at the bottom and medium dunlop in the middle, then go with a medium talalay on top. I'm hoping this doesn't make my matress sleep much hotter though. I'd love to go all talalay for that reason but it just seems too soft in the support layers I guess. I think i messed up ruling out dunlop because it was considered not as cool as talalay but i didn't realize talalay was so soft to the point where if i stand on the bed at 160lb my foot goes to the foundation. On their configuration site it says I should have went dunlop in the support layers but when on the phone with them when I said i wanted talalay noone told me it wasn't a good idea.

Phoenix, any recommendations you can make would be appreciated. I live in upstate NY but I plan on going to New York City area this weekend and could possibly try out some additional mattresses there to help me calibrate what I need to try next from sleepEZ. Do you have any recommendations for a 160lb 5'6 stomach sleeper?
Last edit: 07 Aug 2017 23:16 by Csj0952.

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08 Aug 2017 14:04 #16 by Phoenix
Hi Csj0952,

I've had my mattress since last Thursday. I ordered 9inch with 2inch Soft, 3 inch Medium, 3 inch Firm (all talalay). I set it up the first night as soft on top, medium in the middle and firm on bottom but felt it as plush as my old beachside matress if not more plush. I was disappointed to say the least but figured I'd give it one night in this configuration.


OK, you ordered the softer configuration of what SleepEZ recommended for you as a stomach sleeper – thanks for the update.

Well I slept on it but woke up again in back pain (maybe this could have been residual back pain from prior nights on the older matress but I dunno)


While this was only one night, my suspicion would be that for a stomach sleeper the plush is too soft for your upper layer in this combination, as we discussed in my previous reply. And yes, there is normally some “learned alignment” from your old sleep system.

decided to reconfigure the matress putting the soft layer on bottom (essentially hiding it) under the firm layer and then the medium layer on top. This felt a bit better for the first night and i even had a night where i felt my back pain was going away but now it's starting to return again in my lower back. So much so that I'm trying my best to learn how to sleep on my back or on my side and I'm not looking forward to sleeping at night.


While the softer layer will still contribute to the overall feel of the mattress, on the bottom it will have less influence on your overall surface comfort.

I'm starting to wonder if 10 years of sleeping on my stomach on a rather plush mattress has put my back in a bit of a swayback position by default and by putting myself on a medium firm top mattress that I'm forcing it back into a normal position which is causing me some discomfort.


This certainly could be the case and wouldn’t be uncommon. I don’t know that you are uncomfortable as you are in a better alignment to which your body is unaccustomed, or if you still need a firmer surface comfort. But your current feedback seems to point toward the need for firmer surface comfort layers and firm deep support.

Then again, I'm wondering if I should go back to metro matress and just lay on that pure talaly bliss matress that felt considerably less plush to me than this sleep ez matress.


I’m not sure what that would accomplish unless you were going to purchase that particular mattress, unless you wanted to again get a short-term representation of a firmer overall product. You could also rearrange your layers with the firm on top of the medium and then plush just as a quick method to see if you respond better to a firmer overall comfort with what you have at home (although that isn’t a final configuration I would recommend).

My initial thought is to switch my all talalay matress for firm dunlop at the bottom and medium dunlop in the middle, then go with a medium talalay on top. I'm hoping this doesn't make my matress sleep much hotter though. I'd love to go all talalay for that reason but it just seems too soft in the support layers I guess. I think i messed up ruling out dunlop because it was considered not as cool as talalay but i didn't realize talalay was so soft to the point where if i stand on the bed at 160lb my foot goes to the foundation.


Both Talalay and Dunlop are quite breathable materials, and I think you may have been getting a bit too far “down the rabbit hole” with breathability comparisons. Just because Talalay is more breathable in general than Dunlop doesn’t mean that Dunlop is a poor choice for temperature-sensitive people.

The “softness” you’re attempting to display by standing on your mattress is more an example of the point elasticity of latex, and not a proper example of overall softness, as you can achieve similar results using Dunlop latex as well. You don’t have this high of a specific weight concentration when sleeping upon your mattress, and soft, medium or firm latex can be supportive, Dunlop or Talalay, and you would not be compressing any of the layers completely in a normal sleeping posture.

While Dunlop of a similar ILD will generally feel a bit firmer than Talalay, and there would be no reason against switching some Talalay layers for Dunlop, but the more important thing upon which to focus IMHO would be deleting the soft layer and replacing it with a medium layer at a minimum.

On their configuration site it says I should have went dunlop in the support layers but when on the phone with them when I said i wanted talalay noone told me it wasn't a good idea.


If you phoned and stated that you wanted Talalay, there would be no reason for them to “talk you into” using Dunlop, and there would be no reason that an all-Talalay solution couldn’t work for your sleeping posture, and as you stated that they recommended a medium/medium/firm combination, but you were leaning toward the soft/medium/firm based upon “your prior history with mattresses”. While I wasn’t a part of your phone conversation with them, my guess is that (based upon your previous comments here) the switch to the soft layer was part of your expressed preference. And it may be that a medium, medium, firm Talalay layering would work for you, but this is all part of going through the process of a component-style mattress system, and it’s nice that you have the opportunity to “experiment” a bit and eventually find a combination that you enjoy.

Phoenix

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05 Sep 2019 23:05 #17 by Csj0952
So it's been roughly 2 years now and I've not had a good night's rest. Ready to try another mattress as a stupid stomach sleeper trying to switch to side or back. I'm currently on an Ultimate Hybrid from Arizona premium where I switched out soft talalay comfort layer with medium Dunlop. I'm still waking up in lower back pain every morning but when I take business trips and goto hotels I get a much better sleep. Stupid mattress like this fella here from Gaylord opryland provide me a great sleep but I know the quality is iffy after 3 years as materials break down. www.gaylordhotelsstore.com/product.aspx?mattress-box-spring

I think I'm done with Latex and just want to go back to standard Pocket Coil and some good density foam cause I want a cool and springy mattress that I wont' feel like I'm sleeping in but rather on top of but gives enough to not give me shoulder pain.

So I've read countless guides here and I think I'm really good at understanding what makes a good mattress but I'm just looking now to have someone help me with vendor selection options. Most of the preferred vendors offer standard pocket coil and such but I'm hoping to just be alittle lazy here and have someone help me narrow it down to 3-5 options of really strong supportive ZONED pocket coil options allowing me to sleep on my stomach and have my stomach supported but also allowing my knees or legs to sink into the mattress a bit more. I'm starting to think the Leggett and Platt in the ultimate hybrid are actually weaker coils that don't support me enough possibly. I don't know though, it's just a theory cause I really like the feel of the beautyrest black mattress which I've heard has some pretty over engineered hefty coils.

Regardless, I'm looking for 3-5 online vendors with good return policies that have some interesting configurations with Zoned coil similar to Wink beds but without the 1.5 weak comfort layer which provides the weak link. I'm in upstate NY but I'd be willing to drive to NYC 5 hours a way to try or even buy a mattress if it seems to fit me well. Willing to spend up to $3000 for a queen. I know that's excessive but heck, a good night's sleep is huge for me so I'm more than happy to pay for an over engineered bed.

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11 Sep 2019 17:01 #18 by Sensei
Hey Csj0952,

Thanks for the post. I just have a few questions and some thoughts. The AP Ultimate Hybrid uses the Combizone from Leggett, this is the firmer of the two most commonly used coil units. Here’s some information on the Bolsa and the Combi-Zone . The Bolsa is more or less the “standard” pocketed spring from Leggett and Platt. It can be manufactured in many different varieties per a manufacturer’s request (gauge, turns, profile, diameter…). The Combi-Zone is a combination of different styles of pocketed springs in different zones. Possibly you need a firmer unit than this, not sure.

What is your BMI?
What part of Upstate? 5 hours, must be...Rochester/Syracuse are?
What was the difference when you went to med Dunlop, did it help?

Maybe it is the "Latex" it's not for everyone, It may be that you prefer more of the feel of other foam layers, some memory foam, with firm coils.

I will send back a list of the combizone coils vendors on here.

Thanks,
Sensei

Sensei(@ TMU Team)
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