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Advice on latex mattress comfort layer 28 Sep 2017 10:30 #1

Hi everyone! I'm buying my first proper mattress after years of sleeping on a cheap open coil mattress. I've tried a couple of popular bed-in-a-box "universal" foam mattresses, but after reading through this very informative website I realised that I can get a better quality and more durable mattress for a similar or even lower price. I like the feel of these foam mattresses and how they contour around my body to relieve any pressure points, but I would also like to have a more longer lasting mattress (I found both of these universal mattresses use lower density foams). So, I've decided to go with pocket spring and latex combo as they are within my budget and don't tend to have lower quality materials or "weak links".

I'm quite petite (53 kg, 165 cm) and like to sleep on my side and back. I found a reasonable mattress with 1000 pocket springs and 5 cm natural dunlop latex:
www.latexsense.co.uk/harmony-1000-latex-mattress/p22

I need independent advice on whether the 5 cm latex comfort layer is enough? There's another option at £100 more (still within my budget) with 8 cm latex layer, but it comes with 1500 pocket springs, so that might be too firm for me. Another option, also at £100 more, is 5 cm natural talalay latex comfort layer instead of dunlop. I read that talalay is softer than dunlop, but will this be a significant or subtle difference? Will a side sleeper be more comfortable with the softer talalay latex layer? The showroom of this bed company is far away so I can't really go and test these mattresses first, so I would appreciate any advice. Thanks!

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Advice on latex mattress comfort layer 28 Sep 2017 12:49 #2

Hi pdforta,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :)

I need independent advice on whether the 5 cm latex comfort layer is enough?


Unfortunately, there is no way that I’d be able to predict what comfort might be “enough” for you, as it's not possible to make specific suggestions or recommendations for either a mattress, manufacturers/retailers, or combinations of materials or components because the first "rule" of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best "match" for you in terms of "comfort", firmness, or PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences) or how a mattress will "feel" to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress), sleeping positions, health conditions, or "theory at a distance" that can possibly be more reliable than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here ).


The mattress in question uses 3 cm of reflex polyfoam beneath the innerspring unit, and on top of the spring unit is another 2 cm of reflex polyfoam, and then the 5 cm of 65 kg Dunlop latex. 65 kg density would generally be considered a more plush latex. You'd also want to learn of the density (and ILD if available) of the reflex polyfoam layers.

There's another option at £100 more (still within my budget) with 8 cm latex layer, but it comes with 1500 pocket springs, so that might be too firm for me.


That mattress uses the same 65 kg Dunlop, and the same configuration of reflex polyfoam, but the spring unit uses a thinner 16.5 gauge (versus the 16 gauge in the Harmony 1000), so you’d want to speak directly with the manufacturer for their rating of these two models and how they would rate one versus the other to comfort.

Another option, also at £100 more, is 5 cm natural talalay latex comfort layer instead of dunlop. I read that talalay is softer than dunlop, but will this be a significant or subtle difference?


In this model the Talalay is rated at a 60 kg density, so this would have a softer comfort. At a similar ILD, Dunlop will generally have a firmer feel than Talalay, due to the higher compression modulus of Dunlop versus Talalay.

Will a side sleeper be more comfortable with the softer talalay latex layer? The showroom of this bed company is far away so I can't really go and test these mattresses first, so I would appreciate any advice.


A side sleeper generally prefers a bit more conforming surface comfort, but again I can’t predict what you personally may prefer. When you can't test a mattress in person then the most reliable source of guidance is always a more detailed phone conversation with a knowledgeable and experienced retailer or manufacturer that has your best interests at heart and who can help "talk you through" the specifics of their mattresses and the properties and "feel" of the materials they are using (fast or slow response, resilience, firmness etc.) and the options they have available that may be the best "match" for you based on the information you provide them, any local testing you have done or mattresses you have slept on and liked or other mattresses you are considering that they are familiar with, and the "averages" of other customers that are similar to you. They will know more about "matching" their specific mattress designs, options, and firmness levels to different body types, sleeping positions, and preferences (or to other mattresses that they are familiar with) than anyone else.

Their detailed knowledge of their mattresses and how they fit with different body types and sleeping positions along with your feedback from local testing, a customer base of many people that they can use as reference points, and any exchange, return, or any options they have available to customize a mattress after a purchase can help lower the risk of an online purchase. These online retailers or manufacturers can also be a good "value reference" for local purchases to make sure that if you are paying a "premium" for a local purchase (in exchange for the kind of "in person" guidance, service, and value that comes with dealing with a local retailer that can help you make more "accurate" choices that you have tested in person) is not too high.

I hope that information helps.

Phoenix
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Advice on latex mattress comfort layer 28 Sep 2017 13:31 #3

Hi Phoenix,

Thanks so much for your useful advice!

I noticed they use 34 kg per m3 (around 2.1 pcf) density reflex polyfoam in their polyfoam base + latex top mattresses, which is good quality, but not sure if they use the same density for the pocket spring ones, so I will ask them to make sure. I did not notice the difference in the gauge of the springs between the two units, so this can make the 1500 one a bit less firm. But again, I will call them soon to find out the most suitable mattress for me. They do offer up to two free exchanges within 105 days if things don’t work out with the first purchase, which is why I thought it’s worth giving them a try.

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Advice on latex mattress comfort layer 28 Sep 2017 13:58 #4

Hi pdforta,

The 2.1 lb polyfoam would be a good quality material. As you aren’t able to test these items in person, the potential return/exchange policy will probably become a more important part of your personal value equation .

Phoenix
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Last edit: by Phoenix. Reason: Updating link to https: status

Advice on latex mattress comfort layer 02 Oct 2017 10:28 #5

Hi,

Just an update on this if anyone is interested. I got in touch with the people at Latex Sense and they gave me some advise and recommendation. For side sleeping, they would recommend a thicker layer of latex (8 cm) to allow the shoulders and hips to sink deeper into the bed. As for the type of latex, Talalay is softer and Dunlop is firmer, but when combined with pocket springs they both would feel firmer compared to an equivalent all latex mattress. So the Dunlop is not ideal for side sleeping as it may be too firm and may cause pressure point pains. This leaves me with the Vitality 1500 model (1500 pocket springs plus 8 cm Talalay).

The cost of this mattress (£640), however, is well above my original budget (£500). Also, as this is still essentially a pocket sprung mattress, I think it is not a good value for money anymore because at around that price point I can get their base line all latex mattresses. Their cheapest 100% natural Dunlop models come at £575 for 16 cm thickness ( Super Comfort ), and £685 for 20 cm thickness ( Premium ). Both of these are available in soft comfort rating and are guaranteed for 15 years (instead of 10 years for the pocket sprung mattresses). I am now inclined towards buying either of these all latex mattresses instead of the pocket sprung. This would mean postponing my mattress purchase for a couple of months to get enough fund, but if the end result is better I would rather wait.

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Advice on latex mattress comfort layer 02 Oct 2017 10:54 #6

Hi pdforta,

Just an update on this if anyone is interested. I got in touch with the people at Latex Sense and they gave me some advise and recommendation. For side sleeping, they would recommend a thicker layer of latex (8 cm) to allow the shoulders and hips to sink deeper into the bed.


Thanks for your update.

With the models that they offer, this particular one might be a better choice for a side sleeper. You can read a little more about different sleeping positions in this article . All of the layers of a mattress work together to provide overall comfort, but changes made in the uppermost layers will be the most noticeable in initial comfort.

As for the type of latex, Talalay is softer and Dunlop is firmer, but when combined with pocket springs they both would feel firmer compared to an equivalent all latex mattress. So the Dunlop is not ideal for side sleeping as it may be too firm and may cause pressure point pains.


I’m guessing this is in reference to the particular models you were comparing in their line up, correct? These statements would not apply “across the board” to similar offerings from other manufacturers and companies, which is why I ask.

The cost of this mattress (£640), however, is well above my original budget (£500). Also, as this is still essentially a pocket sprung mattress, I think it is not a good value for money anymore because at around that price point I can get their base line all latex mattresses. Their cheapest 100% natural Dunlop models come at £575 for 16 cm thickness ( Super Comfort ), and £685 for 20 cm thickness ( Premium ). Both of these are available in soft comfort rating and are guaranteed for 15 years (instead of 10 years for the pocket sprung mattresses). I am now inclined towards buying either of these all latex mattresses instead of the pocket sprung. This would mean postponing my mattress purchase for a couple of months to get enough fund, but if the end result is better I would rather wait.


All of the things that you mention are important part of your own personal value equation . Also, post #13 here has more about the most important parts of the "value" of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists.

Phoenix
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Last edit: by Phoenix. Reason: Updating link to https: status

Advice on latex mattress comfort layer 02 Oct 2017 11:23 #7

"I’m guessing this is in reference to the particular models you were comparing in their line up, correct? These statements would not apply “across the board” to similar offerings from other manufacturers and companies, which is why I ask."

Yes, this is in reference to the Harmony (Dunlop) and Vitality (Talalay) models in their line up. So in general, the firmness of the latex layer should not be affected by the pocket springs underneath?

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Advice on latex mattress comfort layer 02 Oct 2017 13:12 #8

Hi pdforta,

Yes, this is in reference to the Harmony (Dunlop) and Vitality (Talalay) models in their line up. So in general, the firmness of the latex layer should not be affected by the pocket springs underneath?


Thank you for that clarification. ;)

All of the layers of a mattress work together to create overall comfort, but the statement of “Talalay is softer and Dunlop is firmer” wouldn’t necessarily be true for all mattresses (this would be determined by the ILD/density of the types of latex being compared, with Dunlop having a higher compression modulus), so this is why I was curious if the statement applied to the specific models you are comparing, which is what you confirmed.

but when combined with pocket springs they both would feel firmer compared to an equivalent all latex mattress.


This is the other statement I was curious about, but as you confirmed this is specifically in relationship to the exact items you are comparing. Innersprings and latex support cores come in many different firmness levels, so again this statement wouldn’t be one with general applicability, except as it applies in your specific situation, which Latex Sense is stating that their mattress with the innerspring unit will feel firmer than their models using a latex support core.

Thanks again for clarifying that for me.

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
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