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12 Feb 2018 12:16 #41 by Phoenix

Hi tiredoftired.

Welcome to our forum! :)

Sorry to hear that your nights are restless and that you are in pain. I can certainly understand that you are tired of being tired.

The latex topper from Sleep On Latex can be a good way to test and see if you like the feel of latex but the topper by itself may not tell you much about how this will play out for you in a component style system that you seem to be considering.

I have looked at a few of your member sites, including mattress.net for DYI. PlushBeds has the ability to change up the layers, but not sure how effective that is—marketing ploy? And they are more expensive than SleepOnLatex.


You are correct that there is much trial and error with a component style system, especially when purchasing one layer at a time because you cannot asses how the layers interact with each other or how suitable any layer combination would be for you. All the layers and components in a mattress work together, affect each other and they lend some of their qualities to the layers above and below and affect the feel and performance of the entire mattress. Trying the topper you purchased on your old sleep number bed or on the “improved” mattress in your guest room will give you little meaningful information about what is suitable for you in terms of support/alignment and comfort/pressure relief. This post has a little more information about how the layers of a mattress work together.

Both Mattressess.net (Arizona Premium Mattress) and Sleep On Latex are our Trusted Members here which means that I think very highly of them and that I believe that they compete well with best in the industry in terms of their quality, value, service, knowledge, and transparency and I have no doubt that if you chose to go with an online option of purchasing your mattress, they will offer very good guidance and advice.Just to set the record straight… Plushbeds is not a member of our site, although they have been mentioned on our forum

but I’m wondering if anyone can suggest ways to narrow this down—short of buying, trying, returning several different mattresses! The only local access for latex we have is a store carrying Oregon Mattress Company (which I don’t see mentioned anywhere) and they are very expensive, +/- $4000 for their top model. Thanks!


While nothing has a 100% success rate, in your case and if possible, it would be good to do some personal local testing... using the expert advice of a knowledgeable and experienced retailer or manufacturer will usually result in a mattress choice that is well inside a suitable comfort/support range and will generally be "close enough" so that if any fine tuning is necessary it would be relatively minor and involve different mattress pads, sheets, mattress protectors, or perhaps even a topper if a mattress is too firm (see post #4 here and post #10 here ).

One of the advantages of trying mattresses locally is that you can try many different types and styles and combinations of materials and components and firmness levels and compare them to each other in "real time" based on your actual experience rather than just "theory" instead of trying one online mattress at a time and not knowing how it compares to the other mattresses that you could have tried or purchased instead.

If you chose to do some local testing, and if it is not too difficult for you to take a short drive you have some very good options close by and then decide which type of product may feel best for you. Parklane Mattresses is one of our trusted members with their headquarters in Tualatin 20 minutes’ drive away from you, and a few showrooms a little further Lake Oswego, Oregon, (30 minutes away) Clackamas, Oregon, (40 minutes) and I would encourage you to give them a call and visit them. They manufacture their own beds and have many quality mattress types and options available of very good value and for different budget ranges.

I would suggest that you revisit the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice ... and perhaps, more importantly, know how and why to avoid the worst ones. Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure you've read are [url=]post #2 here [/url]which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best "match" for you in terms of "comfort", firmness, and PPP that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn't turn out as well as you hoped for and[url=] post #13 here [/url]which has more about the most important parts of the "value" of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well he will sleep), durability (how long he will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you (including the price of course and the options you have available after a purchase if your choice doesn't turn out as well as you hoped for).

If you’re too overwhelmed with going through the entire mattress shopping tutorial, then in its simplest form ... choosing the "best possible" mattress for any particular person really comes down to FIRST finding a few knowledgeable and transparent retailers and/or manufacturers (either locally or online) that sell the types of mattresses that you are most interested in that are in a budget range you are comfortable with and that you have confirmed will provide you with the all the information you need about the materials and components inside the mattresses they sell so you will be able to make informed choices and meaningful comparisons between mattresses and then ...

1. Careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in this tutorial) to make sure that a mattress is a good match for you in terms of "comfort", firmness, and PPP ... and/or that you are comfortable with the options you have available to return, exchange, or "fine tune" the mattress and any costs involved if you can't test a mattress in person or aren't confident that your mattress is a suitable choice.

2. Checking to make sure that there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress you are considering relative to your weight/BMI range that could compromise the durability and useful life of the mattress (see the durability guidelines linked above)

3. Comparing your finalists for "value" based on #1 and #2 and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

Phoenix


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12 Feb 2018 21:04 - 13 Feb 2018 04:52 #42 by Dreamer

I can't find how to start a thread.

I'm looking to buy 1-2 layers of natural latex right away. Then another 1 layer within a week or two, to create a very simple DIY "mattress". Eventually I'm thinking of cutting to make zones.

I'm putting the "mattress" directly on a hardwood floor, which seems to change the feel a lot, although I could put a piece of 1/2 inch carpet pad (or more than one carpet pad) as the base layer.

1. I'm trying to figure out whether I want an extra firm Talalay layer, firm Talalay, medium Dunlop, or something else. My gut tells me extra firm Talalay but I think that's just because I'm not used to latex, so I feel like I need very firm. I feel that my preferences are different from most people's and that I would like being able to sink in just a little at the hip and shoulder, as long as that layer was still very supportive. I think that I need as much support as possible, while still considering comfort. I have weak ligaments/muscles and feel that I can sacrifice a lot of the comfort to get more support. I feel like sinking is bad in general, however. I like to sleep on my back and my side, and when I'm on my back, sinking seems to cause the hammock effect which compresses my shoulder and hips toward my middle too much. The hips are more weighty and seem less of a problem than the shoulder, they just compress and sink in. The shoulder not being able to press inwards seems like the biggest issue, but I also feel like I need very firm underneath my back when I sleep on my back. Would it be much healthier if I made a choice and always slept on my sides? I feel that my neck is an issue too, and the main reason I switch between my back and sides is to give my neck more break (sleeping on my back seems to do that). I do love my Tempur pillow which is pretty good for side-sleeping and back-sleeping.

2. I don't know if I should get a 3" or 2" top layer, or less. It seems like the firmer I go, then there's less point in getting 3", and I want something pretty firm so 2" is fine? 1.5"? But I also noticed one seller charges almost the same for 3" versus 2" so should I get 3" if it's only like 3% more cost? On the one hand, I am only around 130 lbs, which also ties into the question above. I think that someone who weighs less will subjectively feel like the material is firmer, so maybe I should not consider firm Dunlop or extra firm Talalay? However, I have wide hips and shoulders, and feel like I might need to sink in a little more, to get proper spine alignment. (However, my spine already has abnormal curvature, and I've slept on bad surfaces for most of my life.) I am thinking that 2 inches is plenty for the top layer. I'm used to sleeping on a 1.5" top layer which is Tempur's medium. I belive it's 5.3 lb. The memory foam is not working for me, I need the latex support, but it seems to show that 2" is enough? It seems like my hips do sink past the 1.5" as my current base layer that's not working for me is a medium sofa foam, I'm not sure of the density, but I would say it's average so around 33 ILD?

3. Given how I feel about the current base layer, I'm thinking a firm dunlop for sure? Ok, I'm not sure! The current base layer is too compressible for me even though it's on the hard floor, but sort of works? I think the tempur layer is more to blame than the current base layer. Current base layer is 3". I am trying to keep costs down, so I was thinking maybe 2" if I get a 3" top layer, or if I get a middle layer. I have been sleeping on 4.5" total for a year and it's unsupportive material but thick enough for me, apparently.

I feel like it would be too hard for me to visit showrooms because of my medical condition, and I am in a hurry to get the first layer which should be an improvement. I think that whatever layer I get first, I will end up pairing it with the 1.5" or 3" tempurpedic (which is the 1.5" doubled over), although I am very eager to get away from the memory foam, as it seems to be the opposite of what I need (the latex which springs back immediately).

I would love any input on what to get first, and what to aim for!

More thinner layers seems interesting so I have more options to rearrange them, especially when I try to make zones? Also, one more factor. Every few weeks, my ligaments/muscles change, and I feel they need more support during that time. I'd eventually like to have a swap out plan for those times, so I just switch 1-2 layers then switch back. Unless the mattress just works all the time!

I've had a soft Talalay and medium? shredded Talalay cushions I loved, but I don't know the density and how to judge from shredded. (Guessing it was only medium.)

Edit: Added more thoughts. The sofa cushion I have, assuming it's 33 ILD, makes me think I want firm dunlop for my top layer. Although this sofa foam isn't supportive enough, latex in a similar ILD seems about right in terms of how much it compresses. I feel like anything that compresses more would be bad. Less could work but I don't know how much less. I am thinking of buying two 3" firm right away. Safer could be to start with one 3", however, that's not a good test if I'm only sleeping on 3" plus carpet pad and other floor pad.

Edit: I've been reading more about layers and since my bottom layer goes directly on the floor, or almost directly, it may need to be a medium, which will seem like firm due to being on such a hard surface. Also, I think the top part of that layer would still be less-firm than a firm, giving me a little more give overall. So I think my ideal may be 3" firm over 3" medium, but I'm still wondering if I should not buy both at once. Maybe 3" firm and 2" medium, with the idea of buying a final 1-2" layer. Or buy just 3" firm, and buy the next piece a few days after. I think that 6.5-7.5" total might work better for me than 6" since I'm going with firmer on top.

Last Edit: 13 Feb 2018 04:52 by Dreamer.

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13 Feb 2018 06:17 #43 by SnoozyDoodle

Hi Phoenix,
Thank you for your reply from a couple of days ago.

I have read through what you suggested. There is a lot of great info, and a lot to digest.

And I see that doing a diy mattress is tricky.

I have two questions:

1). If I were to buy an innerspring mattress with some sort of pillow top, which brands would be chemical odor free?

2) If I were to try a Sleep on Latex brand Dunlop topper to put on a mattress I already have which is too firm for my joints and back, what thickness and firmness might help me. Again, I am 5’ 8”, 215 pounds with with arthritis in shoulders and hips and have lower back problems. I was thinking about their 3 inch soft, 20 ild. Also if that is a good pick, will it make the edges too soft. It would be going on a twin mattress and I don’t want to feel like I am going to roll off.

Thanks in advance,
Lee

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14 Feb 2018 15:00 #44 by Soappreciative

Guess I'll join the crowd: nowhere on my computer screen to start a new post either!

I'm looking at a mattress at Sleepworld in Asheville. Amanda sent me this info:

"The Hillbrook Eurotop is a 15" thick mattress that features an Individually Pocketed Coil Innerspring unit and is made by Paramount Sleep. The upholstery layers above the coils contain Natural Cotton, Natural Wool, Natural Latex in varying thicknesses and firmnesses. It is hand tufted with an Organic Cotton stretch knit cover and Wool Rosettes."

Then Jeff sent me this (it was in chart form but I'm not able to cut and paste):

Panel fabric:
All over organic cotton stretch knit

Tufting:
Hand Tufted with Wool Rosettes

Product architecture + coils:
Quilt -
Natural FR Rayon Fiber
Luxurious Cashmere Comfort Layer
Super Soft Convoluted Foam 1.3/15
Super Soft Convoluted Foam 1.3/15 [this is NOT a typo; it's exactly what's on the chart)
Quilted Zoned Latex Lumbar

Euro top -
Block of 1.5" Natural Latex
MicroCoil Comfort Layer

Upholstery -
Densified Fiber Pad
Natural Cotton Comfort Pad

Foam encasement -
HD Densified Fiber Pad

Base:
HD Densified Fiber Pad

I have read and read and read the info on this website and still feel overwhelmed! It sooo informative that I'm having trouble condensing it down and applying it to this actual mattress. It doesn't appear to me from what I've read that this info is adequate for me to determine whether there is a "weak link" layer, but I'm not sure. I'd VERY much appreciate any assistance!

Thanks so much.

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14 Feb 2018 16:10 - 14 Feb 2018 16:37 #45 by Phoenix

Hi Dreamer.

Nice to have you back to our forum! Long time no see …. since 2013 :)

You are certainly throwing many variables, unknowns, and a few health concerns in the “pot” and I would strongly advise to do a hard reset and rethink the way you approach this, both because you seem to be in a rush to be done with it which is indicating that the “spirit of adventure” is missing and because you have too many preference questions unanswered. There will be a lot of trial and error in building your own DIY and because it is not clear to you what you really want, the first thing I would do in your case is to slow down, do a bit for research and answer a few of the questions you have that only YOU can answer as only you can feel what you fell on a mattress and no "theory at a distance" that can possibly be more reliable than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see post #2 here

A DIY will not necessarily save you money as it can be quite frustrating at times and involves a lot more knowledge of how different materials, layers, and components interact than many people suspect. You cannot be in a rush with a DIY as there are too many variables that you are considering at the same time and without having a firm baseline of understanding of what your real needs and preferences are (as your many question marks indicate) this can only make things confusing, blur out any clarity you may have and be less likely to be a successful project.
Caution about building your own DIY… lots of trial and error…

If you are attracted to the idea of designing and building your own DIY mattress out of separate components and a separate cover then the first place I would start is by reading option 3 in post #15 here and the posts it links to (and option #1 and #2 as well) so that you have more realistic expectations and that you are comfortable with the learning curve, uncertainty, trial and error, or in some cases the higher costs that may be involved in the DIY process. While it can certainly be a rewarding project ... the best approach to a DIY mattress is a "spirit of adventure" where what you learn and the satisfaction that comes from the process itself is more important than any cost savings you may realize (which may or may not happen).

There is also more about primary or "deep" support and secondary or "surface" support and their relationship to firmness and pressure relief and the "roles" of different layers in a mattress in post #2 here and in post #4 here that may also be helpful in clarifying the difference between "support" and "pressure relief" and "feel" that may be useful as well.

I would normally recommend working closely with a manufacturer who will be able to give good advice about all the different components (option 2 in post #15 here ) over using your own knowledge and separate sources to build your mattress (option 3 in the linked above) but if you want to forge ahead with your own design anyway ... this will provide some options.

Ordering layers separately and where to order would depend on the material you wanted. Local mattress manufacturers and local foam shops can often be good quality and value sources if you want to see what you are buying first or talk to someone that has the skill and knowledge to help you make good choices.
Regarding component suppliers, while not inclusive, there are some options listed here , with a few Canadian sources here . Unfortunately, I don't keep a record of the individual component suppliers in the hundreds of lists throughout the forum or have available online, as it would be a bigger job than anyone could keep up with in a constantly changing market.

Once you have a chance to clarify some of the personal questions that only you can answer and perhaps “sketch out” a simpler design please let me or any of our Expert Members know and if you have more specific questions we’ll be happy to assist you.

Phoenix


Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
For any mattress questions Ask An Expert on our forum
Last Edit: 14 Feb 2018 16:37 by Phoenix.

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15 Feb 2018 07:36 #46 by gojohnnygo89

I too am in the party with a query and unable to create a new thread. My question however pertains more to shipment of a mattress.

About 7 months ago, I bought a Brooklyn Bedding titan foam mattress, for which I am relatively satisfied with. Due to career related obligations, I have to move from LA --> Miami. I was wondering if it was possible to vacuum compress these latex/latex alternative mattresses as demonstrated on various youtube videos. Otherwise, does anyone have any idea how to fit/transport this mattress in my little 2013 Honda Civic across the country?

Thanks so much in advance with assistance with this matter.

Jon

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15 Feb 2018 07:59 #47 by MattressToGo

While you won't be able to get the compression as much as when your mattress originally arrived (as I'm guessing you don't have room for a $250,000 compression machine in your garage :lol: ), this video shows how I'd go about it. I've used this technique with much success in the past. Be sure to have some good packing tape to wrap around the product once rolled into a tube, and I would place a secondary bag over it, as air will leak back in for sure over the time you transport it so you'll need to prevent it from reinflating in your car. A decent home vacuum can do the trick, or even better yet a shop-vac or similar. And two people work a lot better than one when taping up the rolled/compressed product.


Jeff Scheuer, The Beducator™ Owner of Mattress To Go
Researching for a mattress?... read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Trusted Members

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10 Mar 2018 13:22 #48 by coast

How can I start a thread/post a topic?

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11 Mar 2018 03:10 #49 by Phoenix

Hi coast.

We are busy on the back end implementing the – Talk to the Experts features and while it is under construction we have temporarily eliminated "New Topics" from the General Mattress, allowing the creation of "New Topics" only from the Experts dedicated areas where you can ask our Experts directly a question. When time permits and when appropriate I will add any relevant information that may be helpful.

 For now you could focus on an area of expertise that seems to be closer to what you are looking for and start a New topic here (More will become available soon)

You can also peruse and Search our forum for a topic that is relevant or close to what you are looking for and I'll reply as soon as I have some time ....

Thank you for your understanding and I or any of the Expert Members of our site will be happy to assist you.

Phoenix.


Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
For any mattress questions Ask An Expert on our forum

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12 Mar 2018 09:27 - 12 Mar 2018 09:30 #50 by kakhea

Phoenix,

I have been searching the topics & forum post on this site for days now. First of all, kudos for creating an awesome resource!

Now, onto my question: with the help of the files here, I narrowed down my choice to latex, or latex hybrid. Yesterday, my husband and I went to IKEA to try their latex/hybrid mattresses, since it's the only place around me I knew would definitely have them. There are 3 models available: MATRAND) latex/poly ($), MYRBACKA) latex/unknown, and ($$) MORGONGÅVA) natural latex ($$$). All were medium/firm, but we liked the cheapest one, MATRAND, the most (page 9). What's up with that? How can three mattresses that all supposed to be med/firm from the same company feel so different!?

My original plan was to go all latex for a mattress, but now I'm worried about buying online. The MORGONGÅVA was REALLY hard, so much so that it hurt both of our backs. The MYRBACKA was okay, but still too firm. The MATRAND was perfect for him the second he laid down, and after a couple of minutes of laying on it, it was decent for me.

IKEA being themselves, I can't tell which type of latex it is, and am having trouble getting the specifics. I read somewhere that the MATRAND has 1.7 lb density polyfoam as the core, which worries me in terms of durability. I went into this search thinking I would either DIY with this forum's help/using guidance from a trusted member here, or at least make an educated choice about something less customizable. After going to try the beds, I feel like know less than when I started! I am tempted to buy the IKEA bed with potentially poor(er) materials just to get it over with. :(

How do I tell if all latex is not for me after all? The MORGONGÅVA only had the one solid layer of natural latex-- is that the problem? Would more layers help? (I assume 'yes,' logically, but I feel like I'm drowning in information & possibilities). Before yesterday, I was leaning heavily towards Flexus Comfort or Latex Mattress Factory. I feel really lost!

Any advice? Thanks!

---
Reference: www.ikea.com/ms/en_US/pdf/buying_guides_fy15/Mattresses_bg.pdf

Him: 5'7'' // ~180 // (M) // back-to-side sleeper // sleeps hot
Me: 5'10' // ' ~150 // (F) // back-to-side sleeper
Budget: ~$1500, King

Last Edit: 12 Mar 2018 09:30 by kakhea. Reason: Mattress size

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