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Nest Alexander Signature Hybrid Alterations 02 Nov 2021 09:20 #1

I had a nest Alexander Signature Hybrid medium for about 4 years and have never slept well on it. I'm primarily a back sleeper, but occasionally sleep on my side. I wake up up with lower back pain every morning even with a pillow under my legs. I'm 6'2" and 165lbs.

About a year ago, I moved and had to get the mattress replaced via warranty because the foam moved around and I couldn't fix the issue. They sent me a new version of this mattress and I decided to go with luxury firm, thinking that would help. I still have the same problem.

Would it be worth it to try and keep the coils and replace the top foam with a layer or 2 of latex? Or would it be better to buy a completely different mattress or even try to diy one myself?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated as I haven't slept well in quite a while.

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Nest Alexander Signature Hybrid Alterations 03 Nov 2021 19:18 #2

Hi ByronSleeps.

Welcome to our Mattress Forum. :)

I'm sorry you're experiencing lumbar pain on your Alexander Signature (now renamed the Sparrow Signature Hybrid). Ongoing lower back pain is quite frustrating and is an indicator of any number of things, most often improper spinal alignment from incorrect mattress support.

In other words, lower back discomfort can be caused by a mattresses that are either “too firm” or “too soft” on the surface (common causes of pain when sleeping upon a mattress are listed in post #2 here ). If the mattress is too soft on top or not supportive enough, it could allow you to sink in too deeply and allow for excessive sideways bending of our lumbar/thoracic region. If the mattress is too firm, it may not allow your hips to sink in quite enough and this could leave less support for your lumbar region, which can then allow an excessive lateral bend in this area.

Because you went from medium to firm and are still experiencing pain, my guess is that perhaps you're needing a softer foam as opposed to a firm foam. Would you be able to get your hands on a soft 2" topper that you could use to test whether or not this helps alleviate you lower back pain?

NikkiTMU
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Nest Alexander Signature Hybrid Alterations 03 Nov 2021 20:03 #3

Hi NikkiTMU,

Thanks for your input. I had a 2” medium topper I was using, but it was the same issue. That was before I had done research about mattresses and sleeping.

I’m not sure why I thought the mattress was too soft originally. I think it was probably due to all the info online about firm mattresses being better. After doing a bit of research, I seem to have a new perspective when I lay on my mattress. It’s definitely too firm, as I feel like my whole body just sits on top without really sinking in.

I spoke with nest support and I’ve decided to go with a 3” talalay soft latex topper that I’ll replace the firm top layer with. My thinking is that if this doesn’t work, I’ll give the diy latex a go and use the topper for that. I’ve slept poorly for a few years now and I’m determined to find a solution even it costs me some money.

I’ll let you know how it goes once it comes in.

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Nest Alexander Signature Hybrid Alterations 04 Nov 2021 19:25 #4

Hi Byronsleeps.

It's still surprising to me how much of a science it is when it comes to figuring out a pain point on a mattress. Some nights, my bed feels like the most comfortable bed in the world, and other nights I'm wondering why my back hurts and if my knee pain is mattress related.

I am hopeful the 3" soft topper will help resolve your back pain. If not, and you decide to go for the DIY, we're certainly here to help you through it!

NikkiTMU
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Nest Alexander Signature Hybrid Alterations 28 Nov 2021 20:57 #5

After sleeping with the 3” topper, it feels slightly better. My lower back doesn’t hurt like it did before. Although now I’m getting pain in more of my mid back.

I did some digging into the make up of the mattress and realized that it’s zoned. I wonder if the zoning is the reason I can’t find the right balance? I’d like to reuse the coils, but if zoning is the issue, I’m willing the scrap everything.

I’ve been thinking about a couple diy configurations.

Option 1:
3” talalay soft(currently own)
3” Dunlop med
3” Dunlop firm

Option 2:
3” talalay soft (currently own)
Caliber edge 6”

I’m just debating on whether I want to go full latex or hybrid. Would I need a transition layer of latex in between the coils and talalay? Would these 2 options be similar in softness or would one feel firmer than the other? I forgot to mention my wife likes super soft beds. She’s a side sleeper 5’3” 120lbs. I’m trying to consider her needs as well.

Any advice is greatly appreciated.

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Nest Alexander Signature Hybrid Alterations 29 Nov 2021 10:47 #6

After doing a bit more digging, I don't think it is actually zoned aside from the edges. Would zoning be helpful for a back sleeper at my height (6'2") and my wife, a side sleeper(5'3")? Or would it probably not work for both?

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Nest Alexander Signature Hybrid Alterations 03 Dec 2021 14:16 #7

Hy Byronsleeps.

The reason for zoning is because of the difference in weight, thickness/thinness, and surface area of three main areas of the body that are the most difficult to accommodate.

The first of these is the hip/pelvic area which carries the greatest amount of weight and has the greatest density, no matter what type of body you have, and often has a wider profile (especially in women). The second is the waist/lumbar area which is often lighter and thinner and has a lower density. The third is the shoulder/chest area. The shoulders are narrower and have less surface area (on the side) and will sink in more easily until they reach the torso which is often wider than the hips but lighter and lower density. Dealing with these 3 areas in all the different sleeping positions and differences in body profiles and the difficulties associated with balancing them in terms of pressure relief and alignment is the reason that zoning is sometimes used in more difficult or extreme body weights or profiles.

It's possible you could potentially see some benefit from a two zone mattress.

I’ve been thinking about a couple diy configurations.


If you go the DIY route, you can actually do a split configuration to give both you and your wife the best, most supportive, most comfortable sleep possible.

I’m just debating on whether I want to go full latex or hybrid.


This will come down to preference, mostly. Do you like the traditional springiness/bounce on a mattress? Then a hybrid is the right direction. Do you prefer motion isolation? All foam would be a good choice in that regard.

Would I need a transition layer of latex in between the coils and talalay?


It would be recommended, yes. This way you don't sink into the coils.

would one feel firmer than the other?


People say that coils are generally more firm, but I believe the base of the bed also has a lot to do with how firm the mattress feels.

NikkiTMU
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial. . Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
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Nest Alexander Signature Hybrid Alterations 13 Dec 2021 16:39 #8

Thanks for all the help Nikki.

I returned the 3" Queen Talalay soft for split 3" Talalay soft and split 3" Dunlop medium. My wife loves the soft, so I didn't want to mess with her side. At least she's much happier with our bed now. After 2 nights I feel the tension on my lower back again as I did previously. I'm going to adjust my pillow and see if that can help any.

I'm wondering if adding a 1" or 2" latex soft topper would be of any help. I feel like the rest of my body likes the slightly firmer feel, but my lower back just doesn't get enough support. Or maybe adding small pillow under my lower back would help? I've tried adding rolled up towels before, but it seems to cause pressure on my middle back. Are there any recommended lumbar pillows?

The other alternative would be to scrap the coils and make an all latex bed, but I'm not convinced that would solve my problems. It feels like my upper and lower body has different needs.

Any insights greatly appreciated.

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Nest Alexander Signature Hybrid Alterations 14 Dec 2021 07:22 #9

Thanks for all the help Nikki.

I returned the 3" Queen Talalay soft for split 3" Talalay soft and split 3" Dunlop medium. My wife loves the soft, so I didn't want to mess with her side. At least she's much happier with our bed now. After 2 nights I feel the tension on my lower back again as I did previously. I'm going to adjust my pillow and see if that can help any.

I'm wondering if adding a 1" or 2" latex soft topper would be of any help. I feel like the rest of my body likes the slightly firmer feel, but my lower back just doesn't get enough support. Or maybe adding small pillow under my lower back would help? I've tried adding rolled up towels before, but it seems to cause pressure on my middle back. Are there any recommended lumbar pillows?

The other alternative would be to scrap the coils and make an all latex bed, but I'm not convinced that would solve my problems. It feels like my upper and lower body has different needs.

Any insights greatly appreciated.


Here's what's inside your mattress:



It's basically appears to be several layers of memory/poly foam. So that's why it would feel better on your upper back when switching to medium dunlop (much firmer, less travel) on the comfort layer but for the same reason this is also why it hurts your lower back (dunlop allows less travel than talalay which can be a problem when the bum doesn't travel into the mattress enough so the lower back is supported). While you could try swapping the dunlop medium for a talalay medium or perhaps even zone the layer with a soft/medium talalay from the waist down. I'm not totally sure this would fix your issue since your really creating a Band-Aid to fix the mattress itself (however it's worth trying because it would be the simplest fix and your wife is already happy with her side). Not to create a DIY project out of this but a final option is you could reuse the insides (foams/coils) and get a new cover that would allow you to make adjustments to both your side and your wife's separately. This is the most custom option and it can be expensive while also taking a while to perfect but it's also the most likely to give you exactly what you're looking for. Some things to think about anyway.

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Nest Alexander Signature Hybrid Alterations 14 Dec 2021 10:01 #10

I guess I should have gone with the Talalay medium instead of Dunlop. I can't exchange the latex again as Latex Mattress Factory only allows for one exchange. I am considering buying The Talalay medium and trying that out. I feel like I'm slowly making my way to a DIY latex mattress anyway...

The other considering would be to get a 2" talalay soft topper. I don't think my wife would mind going softer anyway. Only issue with that, is I'm not sure what I would do with it if it didn't work out.

If I wanted to zone my side, how difficult is it to cut latex?

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