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Box Spring/Foundation ? 28 Aug 2012 16:27 #1

I have what I believe is a bad box spring on a year old "Sear's Opedic" mattress me and the wife got. I have already replaced the mattress once because it sunk almost 2" on both sides of the bed (king bed). The replacement mattress has already sunk in less than 90 days.

Aside from the fact that we got a "national brand" mattress with some questions about the material (wish I found this site before our purchase last year). I am thinking of replacing just the box springs.

We are thinking/leaning towards replacing the mattress soon with a latex mattress. That being said, would a KD style slat foundation be ok to use on our current mattress while we were shopping for our new mattress. I'm hoping to buy us a little time while we shop around. I honestly don't think what we have can get any worse LOL!

Our zip code is 30417 (south GA). We don't live too far from Savannah, but based on searching and reading this site for a few days now...there are not any decent options in Savannah for the most part. Honestly we have already been in just about every bed store over there and nothing impressed us the first time around.

We are hoping to stop by OMF this weekend while traveling to Atlanta to check out their Latex mattress. It is the only store recommend on this site that will be remotely convenient for us to check out. Does anyone know if they have the latex mattresses set up on both their spring boxes and a more conventional latex support system? Otherwise we are going to bite the bullet and order online site unseen possibly.

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Re: Box Spring/Foundation ? 28 Aug 2012 20:21 #2

Hi Overcomer,

If the current problems with your mattress or "sleeping system" are connected to a sagging foundation ... then replacing the foundation would help. If they are connected to low quality materials in your mattress that have softened ... then it will help little if at all. Post #2 here will give you a good idea of which types of foundations or box springs generally (but not always) do best with different types of mattresses but if a different type improves your sleeping experience then there isn't a "rule" that says that only one specific type should be used with any particular mattress (unless of course it is part of a warranty condition and maintaining the warranty coverage is an important consideration).

One way to tell is to put your mattress on the floor and see what if any difference it makes. A firm non flex foundation will perform in a similar way to the floor. Post #4 here may also give you some useful information about mattress sagging.

We are hoping to stop by OMF this weekend while traveling to Atlanta to check out their Latex mattress. It is the only store recommend on this site that will be remotely convenient for us to check out. Does anyone know if they have the latex mattresses set up on both their spring boxes and a more conventional latex support system?


Their mattresses will almost always be set up on an "active" box spring and if you want to test them to see the difference between this and a firm non flex foundation ... you would need to ask them to put it on either this type or an adjustable bed (which has a rigid base).

I did a quick scan of your area around Claxton and some of the better local possibilities that may be worth including in your research on a "mattress by mattress" basis and the brands they carry I would focus on (assuming that they can provide you with the specifics of what is inside them) include ...

farmershomefurniture.com/catalog/packages/Bedroom Claxton, GA. Englander (make latex and memory foam)

www.denmarksfurnituremart.com/our-brands/index.html Brooklet, GA. Restmaster (lower end of the budget range) and Englander (made by Spears) latex hybrid and memory foam models.

www.dealsfurnitureofstatesboro.com/ Statesboro, GA. Corsicana, Restmaster, They were not very knowledgeable about what they had on the floor but both Restmaster and Corsicana can be better value in the lower budget ranges (assuming you are able to find out the specifics of what is inside them which may be difficult in the case of Corsicana). No latex.

www.lariscyfurniture.com/mattress.aspx Sylvania, GA. Therapedic.

www.gibsonshomestore.com/ Hinesville, GA. Symbol.

In addition to these ...

Post #2 here includes some of the better options and possibilities I'm aware of in the Savannah, Hilton Head Island, and Charleston area.

Post #10 here includes a few possibilities in the Douglas/Waycross, GA area.

Post #7 here includes the better options I'm aware of in the Jacksonville, FL area.

And post #2 here (which you may have seen) has some of the better options in the Atlanta area.

Of course the better online outlets such as those in post #21 here (who are the members of the site which specialize in online or "on the phone" purchases and guidance) can also be a great source of value and can also be a reference point for value locally as well.

Hope this helps

Phoenix
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Last edit: by Phoenix.

Re: Box Spring/Foundation ? 29 Aug 2012 09:00 #3

Thanks Phoenix!

In all honesty I think the sagging is due to both foundation and the mattress material. We have decided that we would only replace the foundation as a temporary/short term fix at best. But it is not our preference at all.

I have been in several of the stores you listed. Unfortunately the reality is that most of them have only a few mattresses in the store to lay on at all. And they tend to be extreme budget ones that reflect the buying power of a lot of the community.

The store with the most potential is Green Frog...my wife and I spent over an hour in there. We wanted to buy from them simply because they were so extremely nice. The problem is that when we described our sleep pattern, etc, etc they could not point us in the direction of a bed that was suitable...nor could they explain the contents of said beds. For me, I want to know what is inside of the bed that makes it suitable for me as a pretty basic back sleeper of fairly typical height and build/weight.

My wife and I are not snowflakes at all. We both sleep the same way in general and on occasion have our kids jump in the bed with us to make us shift :). We made a mistake with the Sear's mattress for sure. We bought significantly below our initial budget based on a feel in the store.

Memory foam is out for us. I tried to make several tempurpedics work in the stores and would literally break out in a sweat just laying on them. I have thrown 2 of their pillows away for the same reason in the end. The latex beds we tried were great from an initial comfort level...BUT...we simply could not find a store with a full latex bed in house to try out.

I'm actually going to go out at lunch to the Farmers Furniture. I literally live less than 2 miles from there. I have been in there several times for other things and there were very few mattresses. I will see if they happen to have the Englander in stock. Georgia Furniture and Interior was the only store we have not visited...so they are now on our radar too.

Online sleepez is on the list along with a couple of others. Ain't this all so much fun LOL!

Thanks so much for your help! If nothing else I now officially qualify for discounts/benefits that come with membership!

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Last edit: by Overcomer. Reason: typo

Re: Box Spring/Foundation ? 29 Aug 2012 16:27 #4

Hi Overcomer,

The store with the most potential is Green Frog...my wife and I spent over an hour in there. We wanted to buy from them simply because they were so extremely nice. The problem is that when we described our sleep pattern, etc, etc they could not point us in the direction of a bed that was suitable...nor could they explain the contents of said beds. For me, I want to know what is inside of the bed that makes it suitable for me as a pretty basic back sleeper of fairly typical height and build/weight.


As a general rule ... back sleepers need a thinner and/or firmer comfort layer than side sleepers so they are closer to the support layers of the mattress. When you are sleeping on your back ... the "gaps" that need to be filled in (in the small of your back) are not as recessed as when you are on your side so a thinner or firmer layer will still allow this "gap" to be filled in and help support the natural curvature of the spine.

There are some guidelines here for weight/height and some guidelines here for different sleeping positions but these guidelines will also be affected by different types of layering so the most "accurate" way to know is to test mattresses in a store for pressure relief and for alignment (making sure that your heavier parts such as the pelvis doesn't sink in too far and cause "hammocking" and misalignment). You want to make sure that the sleeping position is the same as when someone is standing with good posture so the natural alignment of the spine is maintained in all your sleeping positions.

The store with the most potential is Green Frog...my wife and I spent over an hour in there. We wanted to buy from them simply because they were so extremely nice. The problem is that when we described our sleep pattern, etc, etc they could not point us in the direction of a bed that was suitable...nor could they explain the contents of said beds. For me, I want to know what is inside of the bed that makes it suitable for me as a pretty basic back sleeper of fairly typical height and build/weight.


The Pure Latex Bliss mattresses at Green Frog are made of Talalay latex in all the layers from top to bottom. They should also be able to tell you the components of the Restonic models (the person I talked with seemed to know the components of each mattress although the conversation wasn't a long one or very detailed). They should at least have access to the layering information. Perhaps the person you were talking with there was less knowledgeable. In any case ... they would certainly be able to find this information out for you if they didn't have it. Because of the nature of latex ... there is more "room for error" because latex is very resilient and supportive. I would tend to look at the middle of the line though (the Nature or the Nutrition) because the Pamper will be firmer and may need a topper for most back sleepers and the Beautiful will be very soft and more suitable for mostly side sleepers. Of course these are what I call "theory at a distance" and your own experience is always more important than the suggestions of someone who can't see you lying on a mattress.

The Jamison models at Georgia Furniture are also either Talalay latex hybrids (latex over polyfoam for example) or all latex (I believe they have one like this).

I would use your experience in local outlets to experiment with the feel of different combinations of material regardless of the price. Once you have a more general sense of the various combinations of materials you tested that best meets your needs and preferences ... these can act as a helpful guideline for an online purchase if the best local value has too high a "premium" attached to it. A reasonable guideline for a local "premium" is in the range of 20% over an online purchase with similar layering and materials but this can vary with the person and how close a local mattress was to their "ideal" in terms of what they needed and preferred and how comfortable they were with the additional "risk" of an online purchase. Both PLB and Restonic can have better than average value compared with many other mainstream choices but this will depend on local prices as well of course.

Englander makes a very wide range of different types of mattresses so knowing what you are lying on would be important to be able to use it as a guideline ... or of course if you were considering it for a purchase. They tend to be Dunlop instead of the Talalay you will find in the PLB and the Jamison.

Of course you also have some all latex options (except for a thin quilting layer of polyfoam in the OMF latex models) in Atlanta when you go there and some of these will also have good value and perhaps less of a "premium" over an online purchase so you may be able to both "test" and purchase in the same place.

So at least you have some choices that are "all latex" which will give you some sense of how this type of mattress feels and performs in various combinations of layering and firmness levels.

I would also suggest some initial phone research and conversations with the Atlanta options you have so you will have a better idea of what they have available and which models you may want to test. This can save you a great deal of time when you are in the store and give you a sense of the level of service and knowledge at a particular place that you plan to visit.

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
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Last edit: by Phoenix.

Re: Box Spring/Foundation ? 30 Aug 2012 15:46 #5

We got to check out the Englender Nature's Finest @ lunch today. It has been discontinued and cannot be ordered any longer. No king size beds available anywhere around us. At any rate, it seemed to be a nice bed. The comfort layer felt good, but from what I can tell of the specs I got...there is not much latex in the bed? At least we have a frame of reference going forward, but it is off the table due to availability.

I plan to call sleepez this afternoon to get some info from them. Tomorrow we will check out the OMF if we get there in time. Monday...hopefully...we can go and checkout the PLB at Greenfrog. I spoke with GF this afternoon and they carry the Pamper, Nature, and Beautiful mattresses.

The PLB seems to be quite a bit higher than the sleepez configurations? I guess we see how the PLB feels to us next week and go from there. I hate to say it, but IF cost is equal etc etc...it is almost cheaper to just buy from the internet. It is almost cheaper to ship it back and get a refund than it is to buy from a "local" store where you can't return it...and it costs you $XX just to travel for the day to check it out. I guess it is part of the price you pay for living in a rural area.

The wife woke up in a lot of pain today. I was less than 100% myself, so we are definitely in full blown research/shopping mode!

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Re: Box Spring/Foundation ? 30 Aug 2012 19:28 #6

Hi Overcomer,

Steps in the "right" direction :)

You will certainly find that better local manufacturers or sleep shops will often have better value than other more mainstream choices. The PLB is often more than either local (such as OMF) or online mattresses that uses similar materials but in turn is better value than most of the "mainstream" mattresses it competes with. The profit margins on the PLB are very high.

So even though the source of materials in the PLB may be the same as SleepEz (and other better value manufacturers sold direct or through better stores) because the manufacturer of the latex owns PLB ... they are usually not in the "best" value range (although I would still purchase them compared to most other local mainstream choices such as any Stearns and Foster or other top end mattresses that sold at significantly higher prices).

I generally suggest a guideline of about 20% or so (and each person can decide this for themselves based on their risk tolerance and the service, products, and policies of the local stores) as a "premium" for a local purchase where a mattress can be tested in person but beyond this ... then an online purchase which offers additional benefits (such as a lower price or refunds) or in some cases the ability to make adjustments after a purchase through layer exchanges can start to make a lot of sense.

My first choice would be local when possible, and sometimes these can be even better value than many online choices ... but the online manufacturers are a great reference point for those who don't have great value available locally and who are willing to take on some additional risk (which of course varies between different online outlets). Making meaningful comparisons and then choosing between all the "tradeoffs" that are involved is part of each person's "value equation". It's great to know though that no matter where you live in the country ... there is good value available. The goal is always to end up choosing between "good and good" :)

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
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Last edit: by Phoenix.

Re: Box Spring/Foundation ? 30 Aug 2012 23:03 #7

Thanks Phoenix...

I mentioned the 20% rule to my wife before I saw your post and I agree. Fortunately for us the difference in physically getting a mattress to our house want matter much between now and Monday.

That said, I did speak to both SleepEZ and GreenFrog. SleepEZ was able to recommend a configuration for us and the price was obviously really clear from their website. Based on their insight...it seems that what we need will be a little firmer than the PLB offered at GF. So our plan is to go and check out the PLB on Monday. I'm not sure, but I suspect the price may be over the 20% so we would have to really like it to consider it.

I personally don't mind spending a little extra in order to support my local economy. Either way a rubber tree is donating to the cause LOL! IF we get their in time tomorrow we will stop by OMF just to keep all options on the table. It's still free to look at anyway.

The hard part for me (us really) is making sure that feeling good in the showroom doesn't get in the way of what we really need. Anything in the store feels better than what we currently have, so we have to stick with the facts along with everything else.

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Re: Box Spring/Foundation ? 31 Aug 2012 00:31 #8

Hi Overcomer,

That said, I did speak to both SleepEZ and GreenFrog. SleepEZ was able to recommend a configuration for us and the price was obviously really clear from their website. Based on their insight...it seems that what we need will be a little firmer than the PLB offered at GF. So our plan is to go and check out the PLB on Monday. I'm not sure, but I suspect the price may be over the 20% so we would have to really like it to consider it.


I would also think the difference in "apples to apples" prices (similar amounts of blended Talalay latex and similar covers) will probably be over 20% but you never know what GF may say when you mention your options. The top layers of the PLB are 19 ILD but how they feel will vary depending on the other layers they are combined with. the soft at sleepEz on the other hand is in the 22-24 ILD range which is a little firmer. The OMF latex supreme 1.5" comfort layer on each side is in the 19 ILD range as well (it uses a higher ILD layer then convolutes it so it's softer) but it's thinner and has an inch of soft polyfoam over it. The base layer is also in the SleepEz "medium" range.

I personally don't mind spending a little extra in order to support my local economy. Either way a rubber tree is donating to the cause LOL! IF we get their in time tomorrow we will stop by OMF just to keep all options on the table. It's still free to look at anyway.


You're right it's free to look and a bit more experience on latex will also give you more confidence in whatever direction you decide to go so from a testing veiwpoint it's also valuable.

The hard part for me (us really) is making sure that feeling good in the showroom doesn't get in the way of what we really need. Anything in the store feels better than what we currently have, so we have to stick with the facts along with everything else.


You are wise to recognize the difference between a more subjective and short term "showroom feel" and what you may need and prefer (and will be more comfortable) in the long term. If you keep your testing as specific and objective as possible (sensing for pressure relief and having someone help you check for alignment) and you test for long enough that you are completely relaxed and your muscles have "let go" ... then the odds are much better that you will choose based on longer term needs and preferences rather than just short terms "aaahhh" feelings in a showroom.

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
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Last edit: by Phoenix.

Re: Box Spring/Foundation ? 03 Sep 2012 17:13 #9

We got to check out the PLB mattresses today. Ultimately the Nature was almost exactly what we wanted. When I say almost...my wife I both recognized the pressure relief and proper alignment, but we both would prefer something just a touch softer/firmer for her and me respectively.

Considering all of that, the price was almost 65% higher than the sleepez 10000 series of almost the same exact configuration (but with the option to change if needed). I explained to the salesman at GF what my other option was. Essentially the other latex options were not suitable for us..and there were no other choices in the store we would consider. So unless he could work on his price considerably it wasn't a very good option. He was literally scratching his head at the deal we found online.

The sleepez 10000 has been ordered and it is on the way! Once we get it in and setup I will report back with some form of mini review.

So far, Shawn was great to work with and we got 5% off (mattress only) for being a member here....

Happy Labor Day folks!

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Re: Box Spring/Foundation ? 03 Sep 2012 20:08 #10

Hi Overcomer,

You did some good research, some good testing, made some meaningful comparisons, and ended up with a great mattress that fits your "value equation".

I'd say you did well!

Congratulations on your new mattress :)

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
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